Stop coming here
 

This place is a dumpster fire. The only way we can get improvements in pay and QOL is if you, the potential new hire, stops showing up to new hire class.

New hires, please take time to read the other recent threads on PSA. Do yourself and us a favor.

Current employees, please stop referring your friends to PSA. The referral bonus is nice but it will be peanuts if we can get pay increases.

You've got to wonder how many of us have thougt that since the signing of the "60 day timeline" LOA back in December. We're only 6 months past date for that new agreement. All many of us want/wanted was an official, "we've agreed to extend the date to [whenever], but it's still in the works," from our representation.

When can we open negotiations on a new contract? It's better to right the ship than to jump ship, but at some point you just need to bail (at least those senior to me :))

Yes, folks ahead of me needs to bail also ;)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

2023 filler.

I would hope you folks encourage new-hires to go to American Eagle instead? Ohhhhhhh that's right.....I forgot how you crushed Eagle with that contract you are now complaining about.

Stay classy!!!!

90% of the people complaining on here have been here less than 2 years and have no idea what you’re talking about. Not to mention the regionals of today look nothing like the regionals of 2013.

Stay relevant!!!!

Nothing that people on here are complaining about changed with the 900 deal. It was all already there.......But you knew that already..........No wait......You didn't.

Stay uninformed!!!!

Sad, but true!

you always have the option to make an early departure... I'm disappointed that my fellow aviators would discourage coming here. Everyone has a choice and some guys are eager to get hired and start flying somewhere, depending on "THEIR" needs and desires ...not yours.

For those of us who have been in the business to see the 9/11 days of furloughs and Airlines closing their doors your perspective may be off. I would encourage all of us to look at why we are here or why we are considering PSA...its all what you make of it, and if you always have the option to move on...

DP

This. I totally agree.

And people saying just leave, naw man I bet on this horse I’m gonna stick with it. BUT Had I really known the truth.... I totally would have chosen differently.

I saw someone say something on here that is so true. FOLLOW THE MONEY. Go to RPA or EDV. Wait for the class, it’s so worth it.

Sitting Hot reserve 8 times a month is true. Senior manned to a voluntary move to ORF or PHL is true. And you will spend $800 a month in hotels/Uber’s there.

The absolute only reason to come here is if you live in DAY or CVG. CLT is so senior. 11 months to a LCR line. Ask me how I know.

And to add to this the only way we can get change is by not filling classes. Our MEC has all but said that. And we all know AA is extremely reactionary to the times. They have no desire to proactive. They are so scared of their debt and are trying to get cash flow they absolutely will not invest in itself until they NEED to.

Time from application to class at RPA is approx. 1 month. No need to wait.
EDV is about 2.5-3 months.

Actually, they look entirely the same....

One being whipsawed against another....

Hasn’t changed, it was on the precipice... but the pilots of your airline sold out the movement. Learn history, or be destined to repeat it.

weren't you fired from eagle 3 times?

They look entirely different than they did in 2013. The industry looks entirely different than it did in 2013. And who is being whipsawed against who in 2018?

Why don’t you grow a pair and leave?

The record is 7 firings for a union guy...
At the time, 3 of the past 5 NY CA Reps had been fired at least twice each. It doesn't pay to fight city hall; which is why the regional unions are destined to be window dressing.


Mine was twice, not three.
Turned out to be a blessing.

He’s an idiot. AE guy who wanted PDT and PSA to fold and AE be the only wholly owned AA airline. Unfortunately many saw past that game. However a man getting fired from a regional speaks volumes to his character and what he provides to a work group. That’s almost impossible to accomplish let alone multiple times.

nobody was folding. Jerry Glass of F&H solutions earned his check from AAG. Envoy fires union people because back pay and a fine/penalty is easier than dealing with the difficulty a good union rep causes them. Yes, they violate the CBA that often.

Even the unemployment administrative law judge said it was the most egregious termination he'd seen in 22 years before ruling against the company.

Firing somebody for 4 instances of alleged sick abuse in one year, while refusing to even look at the provided medical records for those same 4 instances... yeah, nothing political going on there.

Then firing them again over a typo on a resignation from a union position claiming they lied. News Flash, the union position isn't really any of their business since the RLA prohibits them from interfering in who does or doesn't do union work. Typo corrected, but MEC chairman neglected to inform company of the correction when the company asked, and poof, the pilot is accused of misrepresentation. Not allowed to explain the misunderstanding, just fired without investigation.

Yep, ultra serious offenses there. Every employer who's looked at the paperwork, hired me. They recognize BS harassment when they see it. Not sure why you don't. We're all pilots, and should stick up for each other rather than continue allowing managements to pit us against one another.

AAG just brought a guy back on the payroll at Envoy as a VP who was the architect of the merger of the Eagles back in 1988. History is destined to repeat itself. The three groups need to start working together or they'll end up screwed again.

Not my battle anymore.

To this, we had better listen.

I've reached out to my brethren at PDT and get the sense that their TA is getting a hard "NO," which is a step in the right direction for all of us. Ratification of that TA would stagnate everyone's pay. This should not be an era of "bring it up to industry average" agreements, it should be an era of industry-leading agreements.

PS: Now give me an AA seniority number already.

Exactly...No concessions, all gains. Too many pilots at PSA do not understand this. The days of concessions to the company should be long gone. You don't have to give something up to get $$$ and QOL improvements when there is a supposedly a labor "shortage" in your given field. :mad:

Some should even consider the junior manning as a concession...

I’ve become convinced that there is no labor shortage. There was a temporary labor “squeeze” felt most in 2016/2017. But with the RTP pilots and the pilots coming through the other programs set up a couple years back I see no real end in sight to their pilot supply. Our only hope for any leverage now is for attrition to start outpacing their ability to hire and train.

That was the initial "squeeze," but I don't think we've seen the real deal yet. If I can get a job at a major right when I hit 2500hrs that changes the landscape even more. I think this is realistic over the next 2 years, pilots getting their 1000hrs of 121 and moving up and out instead of upgrading and sticking around for another 4 years.

Yes, we'll have a supply of new pilots, but we'll see a lack of quality LCAs and likely some serious safety issue which result (hopefully with no loss of life). If something serious does happen that could force AAG's hand on the whole "B scale" staple thing.

There was an event in SAV a couple days ago with over 500 rotor pilots in attendance looking to make the jump to 121. That’s at 1 single event. There is absolutely no shortage. The RTP program is paying off dividends for the regionals that have invested the money and many of the pipeline programs that were set up in 2016-2017 will start bearing fruit around 2019/2020 further increasing the supply. Word is out that pay has come up. Flight schools have plenty of willing students with the funds, they just don’t have enough instructors right now.

As far as an incident or accident happening, I had a lengthy response to that typed out and decided against posting it. Any of us who have been flying at a regional for a while (3-4+ years) knows the score and we can all see what’s happening industry-wide. I pray nothing happens and I pray even more that it doesn’t happen at PSA. Be vigilant and diligent.

Out of those 500 how many are actually qualified?

I personally had two friends attend, both are civilian and PSA doesn't have a civilian RTP program.

Based on the RTAG facebook feed I would guess that maybe 100 of those people were prior military able to start their transition training a year from now.

There were maybe 25 - 50 people able and ready to start a military rotary transition that day.

While there are people in the pipeline - rotor transitions, civilian new starts, etc there will be no huge wave.

All that said, I believe our opportunity to exert the minuscule amount of leverage we may have had has passed us by.

There were certainly more than 100 qualified at the event. The target audience for that group is the ability to transition within 3 years. PSA held interviews over both days of the events, even adding extra interviews onto today to handle the interest. There were over 100 attendees at the PSA meet and greet Friday night. We're still compiling the numbers from the surveys handed out during registration at the event. While it may not be a wave of new hires from this event, which would be limited by the current training capacity anyway, it does seem like a steady stream of qualified applicants will come from this pool for all of the regionals.

What's the longevity of an RTP guy or gal at a regional? I'd imagine with the prior military experience and the 121 experience boxes now checked I bet they could make the jump to a Major or LCC fairly quickly.

I'll be curious to see the percentage that stay long enough to upgrade.

Too new of a program to determine at this point. Envoy's program was the first, and it's only about 18 months old. Maybe this time next year, there will be a better data points. There have been a few rotorheads that moved up, but they had Army fixed wing experience as well as rotary wing.

Most legacy airlines still look at rotor time as if these fellas were riding around on broomsticks for their whole .gov career. I know some have gone to JetBlue and Spirit but only after 2-3 years at their regional get the phantasmical 1,000 hours of 121.

Jeebus Christmas learn how to read...

100 military ready to start within a year is what I said.

Oh I’m sorry. Let me correct my wording....

There were certainly more than 100 qualified candidates ready to transition within the next year at the event.

There’s some Envoy RTP’s that got offered JetBlue positions last year.

All of them were awarded upgrade, in upgrade training or recently finished upgrade.

So it looks like 1000 121 time for an RTP will get them a slot at JetBlue at least.

Not a bad place to hang your hat. If that becomes a common occurrence, hopefully we see some changes at all 3 carriers to stop the hemorrhaging of pilots to anything remotely better.

We need more carrot, less stick.

In the fall of 2019 when the last of the protected pilots flow from Envoy, you could potentially see a lot of movement towards integration of the wholly owned carriers.

A single wholly-owned regional, with 4,000-5,000 pilots?

I'm thinking no, from a risk management perspective.

Infrastructure wise, I think it needs to happen.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There is very little infrastructure, given the wholly owned airlines do nothing except schedule crews, airplanes, and maintenance.

You'll think that is the case, but IT wise, building and property wise, management wise, personnel wise, tell me otherwise. There's costs savings and synergy that can be had. It's not secret this is where AAG is fat and needs to be trimmed.

I think it will happen but not next year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I see an opportunity to consolidate, but think that instead of 1 large entity, there will be two. PSA and PiedvoyWest???

AAG buys Mesa and merges PSA/Mesa. Envoy and Piedmont merge. 2 large WO regionals emerge.