Wow!:eek:

But on another note when I was teaching there I had one 250+kid that was all aces. Felt like I was in his seat.:D

Ive heard some guys here at UND already have an interview with Pinnacle after graduation, most with a grand total of 0 dual given. How do Captains over there treat these guys in the cockpit? Ive heard some get on them pretty good.

Lets see:
You are a no experience pilot and the Captain has up to 50 Souls on Board. The weather is bad, airplane has broke items that affect procedures, lmitations.
You can't find the gear handle with a map.
Can't talk on radio, do not understand the ATC Instructions.

Sure makes sense that the Captain should have as his first priority concern for your feelings, and leading you by the hand through the aviation world.
You may get hiried by a desparate company, just do not expect that people will carry you.

Get some real experience: fly freight, rent an airplane and fly in some night IMC by yourself, then maybe you will be able to hold the gear handle and the radio tuner at the same time.

Make sure you use "Student Pilot Flagship" call-sign.

hahaha you're probably right

When I hit the line I didnt have 100 hours in type yet so I had to tell the captain that I didnt have my 100 hours consolidation of knowledge yet- most guys were cool and would say things like "well I am sure I will teach you something" and they were really nice. Some asked the question- are you a ATP or Gulfstream guy? I would answer "no" and the next question was "well how much time do you have?" When I told them they would chill out and say something to the effect of "you have flown a plane before!" or " wow, someone who actually meets the published mins". the scary thing is that out of the people who didnt make it through all the way to the line we figured out that (in my class at least) it was a 50/50 split between really low timers and the other half being higher time guys. We had one guy leave during sims when he had over 2500 hours and 1500 hours in lears- explain that... So evidently some of the guys can do it, and if not I guess they just learn quickly...:rolleyes: ... I still think 800/100 should be the bare mins but thats just my opinion. What will be interesting to see is what happpens when all these guys/gals reach captain seniority but cant upgrade due to the 3000 hours company min...

[quote=higney85;133306]Some asked the question- are you a ATP or Gulfstream guy? I would answer "no" and the next question was "well how much time do you have?"

It would be nice to get a new contract, or at least here fact and not fiction about the details within the contract. The majority of guys who come from ATP were instructors. I worked there for 18 months and got hired with 650/500, which isn't the highest but I don't have a problem with saying I came from there.

[QUOTE=ctd57;133322]I dont want you to take it the wrong way. I was just passing off what was has been said to me by a few capts. I think they were refering to those who came from ATP with 250 hours. There are some of those guys- a couple were in my class. Great guys and I dont have 1 quam with em, yet I do think -industrywide- there should be higher mins for FO's- since currently its only a commercial/multi. Just my opinion. I hold nothing against someone who is in the industry or a fellow co-worker. Each person has a different path to get to the same place. There are many instructors who were at ATP, but you must admit that there is a big difference in someone just out of training with 250 hours compared to someone with even just 500 hours (after instructing for 250). Instructing, or just flying in general outside of being trained teaches you soo much. I know personally I learned the most in the time from 250 to 500 hours when I had students and had to teach things the first time and learn what students mess up on without them even realizing they were doing something wrong b/c they didnt know any better.

Well I cant speak for all captains.... my theroy is be civil.... no I don't like them and I definately don't think its fair that they occupy spots that could be filled with much more deserving and harder working CFI's and 135 pilots but ultimately it's not my choice.... As for getting on them well if someone's messing up you have say something thats just part of excercising leadership and maintaining control..... Yes I have heard utterences of Captains doing "chew outs" but I have no first hand experience.... just the rumor mill.

higney85 and space monkey, I totally agree with both of you. Like other instructors, I learned the most about flying while teaching others, and also getting the !@#$ scared out of me a couple of times. You have no time to use your certificates and ratings. Those types of pilots have been students most of their flying career. At the same time, my sim partner during training wasn't one of them, and since I am not a captain, will never fly with one of those guys, so I don't know how well they perform. I did hear from one captain that he had personally experienced a lack of situational awareness with his FO.

Thats one of the biggest issues is Situational awareness and judgement..... At 170 hours they have none.... When I was a CFI that was my job to teach, babysit and sometimes if necessary spoon feed..... but all my CFI time was done in piston aircraft.... much simpler and slower than a jet and with much higher tolerances than a jet.... Sadly this is the line and while I agree people do need to develope themselves and grow I think a firm background should be required before they get to this level.... Methaphorically would you want a doctor that only has a bachelors or an associates degree no Med school. or would you want a para-legal as your lead council at a murder trial????? I think that the person with the bachelors should be given a chance to grow to be a doctor by going to the proper schools and interning to eventually being send into the world as a doctor. As well as if the para-legal wishes he or she should be able to go to law school.... but until that person has gained the required level of expertise they should not be doing trials and procedures.