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Originally Posted by EagleEyeAngel
To Theprofessionalpilot (the person who started this thread):
I guess you already figured out by now that it's not such a good idea to start a thread on this forum as a PFT with low times. Because as you can tell, the world starts falling apart and people that claim they're the real pilots, because they earned their way to a job by flying lot's of hours, begin slicing you in half. It seems to me that people forget lot's of times that airlines are not looking for just pilots, but employees as well. Everybody can fly an airplane if you train them. But not everybody is a reliable employee. And it turns out that training centers like RAA provide good reliable employees, hence why the airlines like to pick up these graduates. Also, we tend to forget that it's the airlines that hire. They set the standard. It would be ridiculous not to take advantage of programs that get you a job fast. In my time, they didn't have these training centers. I also worked my way to a job by flying scrap metal for years. I definitely would have opted for an institution like RAA or any other school for that matter if I would have had a choice in my "young" days. As far as people stating that you, as a PFT, will be pushed aside by one of your own... well that's bogus to me. We're in a competitive market. You don't have to be a pilot! If you don't like it, shut the heck up and move on to another industry. All this whining at low time pilots is not going to change the world! Be creative, stay positive and if you love flying, stay competitive. Don't start throwing rocks at newbie’s because you're frustrated. If you want to earn big bucks, go get your MBA and start working a desk job. Being a pilot is not about earning big money. Those days are long over. And whining at new pilots is not going to change anything. It's just going to make the pilot industry look really pathetic. Anyhow, I'm drifting off the subject here and unfortunately that seems to be the case in these forums. The first few replies are to the point (hopefully anyway) and then the slicing the low time pilot commences. How sad. So to get to your answer (if you're still with me anyway): My cousin got through the RAA program and she says that they don't have an agreement with Chautauqua. RAA pilots that get hired by Chautauqua are high time pilots that have been a CFI for many years. Express Jet (Air Wisconsin, PSA, Pinnacle, American Eagle) however picks up RAA graduates at 500-100. Being 21 shouldn't be a problem. As far as picking an airline based on location only is a bit eerie to me. I wouldn't choose an employer based on just that. As far as upgrade to captain in 2 years... good luck! It's possible, not where I work at, but there are some airlines (Mesa, Pinnacle...) where you can upgrade fairly fast. Get married before you go the airlines! Stay positive and you'll get where you want. Don't ever turn into a whiner, that's the real loser right there! Wish you all the best! Thx. |
So, at RAA you spend around 72k to get hired at 500 hours? There are schools out there where you could spend half that, instruct another 500 hours (six months), and be at the same place...qualified as an entry level F/O.
Spending time as a CFI makes you a better pilot, overall. I'm glad RAA guys at least get their CFI's and work as CFI's for a time. That takes them off my Gulfstream/FSA direct track sh*t list. ATP CFI's can get on with low time, too, if they do the RJ transition course. They can also instruct another 500 hours and skip it. Whatever floats your boat, I guess. |
RAA or bust
Yea there are a lot of scum school out there. But, lets remember to do our research before bad mouthing other peoples homes. RAA is my home and I really enjoy my time here. We recieve top notch training. Our students pass checkrides with the Orlando FSDO on a daily basis, and lets not forget the Orlando FSDO is the strictest and hardest FSDO to become certified in the entire United States. We do boast a 98% hiring rate and well duh...just come to RAA and see. We had 7 people hired within 2 weeks. Now that may not be that many but you must consider the fact that we only have about 150 active students and instructors. So, I'd love to stay and tell you all the great things about RAA but that would be a waist of time because most people make their minds up well before opening their eyes!
Ben CFI MEI |
"I'd love to stay and tell you all the great things about RAA but that would be a waist of time"
No...it's a waste of time, not waist... Keep drinkin' that Koolaid, dude, must be some good stuff.... |
What a *Pilot* is Worth - go corporate and get paid go RJ and get bent .... a table!
EagleEyeAngel (a lot of this is not to you personally, I just ended up ranting. I can't find a good place to seperate from you and the others),
I appreciate your enthusiasm. I really do! It's good to be able to take a step back and here some refreshing comments on these posts. They have the tendancy to suck me into the banwagon - not pointing my finger! I have obtained INCREDIBLE experience being a CFII/MEI for my flight school. Unlike most CFI's out there, though, I am making a decent living at it. It's sad to see so many people thinking that just because they are CFI's means they must be walked on and underpaid. I suppose that's why I have waited to go to the airlines (and because I have local job offers that are offering about 260% or so more than regional pay). I simply cannot afford to work so hard and get paid peanuts as you guys put it. I wish I could!!!! I want to fly the "big stuff" - to me it's big anyways! I am sure some of you guys have seen my ad's on ebay, etc about ME programs and you wonder "Why is this guy charging people 350/day?!? Is he nuts?!?" The answer to your question: No, in actuality you must be nuts! I have spent a lot of money on my certificates, etc, so I will be paid, just like that electrical contractor next door to me. My risk of death, injury from students, etc has GOT to be at least 500% higher than that electrician's worst fears! I have been busier than I could have ever dreampt of (which is what I need to get out of here ASAP), but it has also created an abundance of profit as well. I cannot WAIT to fly corporate, or regional, whichever happens first. But I am not going to beat down their doors to get paid less than what I make per day and fly 50X larger aircraft for longer hours. I'm not harping! Just want to give you guys a dream, and IT CAN BE ACHIEVED. I have my entire loan paid for in less than a year for my flight training... an Aztec that isn't so hot, but it's 1/5 mine, paid for. I know this might not sound like much to you guys, but I have found my niche which I kicked and screamed going into (because I knew I could have done a direct track program). And now I would not have given it up for, "that's right, ALLLLLL the tea!" Can anyone please tell me to shut up if being a CFI is not a great gig if you can find the right place to do it? I have found that where employees are paid great waiges they provide great services to their employers which leads to greater success. I have also watched it become true with my very own training packages (i'm NOT selling something here, except an idea that we are all worth a little more than 18/hour). I also want to note that I am not trying to complain anymore, so I appreciate all of your advise and patients (I think I spelled the kind that go to doctors' offices, it's late). I'm living the dream right now - and I haven't even flown 4.0 hours of turbine yet. How is it so? I value my time, and so should you. I'm am exception to a lot of rules... but WHY IS THAT? The question "What am I supposed to do? WAIT?" MUST have an answer, and if your answer is "Get hired, walked on, poor paychecks, long hours, etc, then go to a larger airline" then that is your porogative (SP?). I respect you GREATLY, so don't think I am downing you. I COULD not survive in that environment. But if you value your experience/time then charge for it. If you do not have the TT/ME then charge a little more than average. Once you notice that only people with a REAL agenda want to fly with you because they know a higher paid CFI will give higher VALUE flight training, then you can raise your paycheck $5/hour.... allow 6 months to expire... repeat. You've probably just become a flight instructor who makes $60, that's right, $60/hr and works 6 hours per day. I have given up keeping my resume up to date because of flying so much and getting nothing but multi-time. Sure 99% of it is vfr training but so what? It's still flight time (yeah, i KNOW instrument time is important, doing what I do and how I have done it makes that difficult!). I am going to give you guys a little secret on how I got so many hours and made so much per hour... think of where you live, what is next to where you live or near, then figure out what people could do in your area and FOCUS. Get fliers out and advertise in the paper. Before long you have your own branch of a flight school or aerial tour company with a fleet of Cessna's, etc. You DREAM it and can MAKE it. My dream was to make an "International Flight Training Package" and it works. About 10 of those flights per month and you cannot imagine how great it is to say "I just got back from The Bahamas." "No I gave someone a flight lesson on how to go in and out of US Airspace." It sells, and if you do a program for ... I dunno Montana, I guaruntee you there is something that locals will WANT to do and PAY for it. Don't sell yourself short and get paid 10/hr or even 15/hr. The least I ever get paid is 20/hr when I am doing primary training. 20/hr.... why would I make more money flying a Cessna 152 than flying a CRJ-200??????????????????????????? ANSWER THAT QUESTION. If your answer is "the future" then I want to know how you plan on living for the first year (THE PRESENT!!!!) and not losing every friend and loved one you have because you can't handle the stress of not being able to pay bills. I could go on forever, guys/gals, so with that I will leave you guys with a big "?" and ask you "What are you worth?" I know I'm bragging a little, but I am also confused WHY AM I BRAGGING AND NOT YOU? |
And stop knockin each other down! I know I did it a few months back, but I guess I grew up when I hit 21. People change, and some people cannot spell to save their lives but they are the smartest people you know. Still giving people a hard time about their spelling.... please, grow up and and at least ACT professional like you probably ARE.
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Well...I just thought it was funny. I'm a UPS 757/767 F/O going to Capts school in a couple of weeks. If the guy wants to try to convince me that RAA students could possibly deserve/earn a jet type rating at 500 hours, then I'm happy to engage in an intelligent conversation with him. Until then, it's a waste of time. Not waist....
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Just my .02
Everyone is responding to this issue based upon their own personal experiences; and that's cool :cool: ! I believe there is room for ALL of us no matter what "type" of flying each one us wishes to pursue.
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I'm totally lost with this "what are you worth..." post. Seems to me that you need to straighten things out in your head first buddy! You start a thread asking people about what regional airline to pick, and now you're showing off that you earn big bucks as a CFI and that the airlines and their pilots can go to hell... or something like that? Who are you even talking to? Best wishes!
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Lets face it
There are lots of young guys and girls out there that want to be flying the big tin can more than anything. I think its important that we respect eachother because we are all in the same community. No matter how we get our training shouldn't matter. What matters is quality. There are good students and bad students. Along with that, there are good captains and bad captains. But lets always remember the only enemy here is those SCABS out there flying jets for dirt....their the ones hurting the industry. Not us low time pilots getting hired and working for a reputible airline.
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