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-   -   Rejected by Envoy and Mesa (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/126891-rejected-envoy-mesa.html)

havick206 01-24-2020 02:12 PM

My bet is on social media presence.

rickair7777 01-24-2020 03:10 PM


Originally Posted by havick206 (Post 2963573)
My bet is on social media presence.

Does mesa, of all airlines, really even look at that? They have enough trouble getting folks who are legal for an R-ATP and SIDA clearance.

viper548 01-24-2020 04:23 PM

I'd suggest you pay for an application review and interview prep course. Normally I'd say don't waste your money when applying to regionals, but getting turned down by Mesa makes me think there's something in your background check or application that needs fixing.

tonsterboy5 01-25-2020 07:33 AM

Something doesn’t add up. I have a feeling you are not telling the truth, that and never ever downplay anything. When you say you failed “just” your private. You are down playing it. Specifically saying 10% over you are downplaying it.

Saying you got pulled over 2 times in a very short period of time and got a ticket for 10% over I call bs. Maybe that’s what they wrote on the paper but very few places will stop for you for going 5-8 over and give you a ticket every time. Also same goes for a light. You must of really rubbed off wrong on the cops which is the same way you rub off on the interviewer.

pay for interview help to fix how you rub off on people

NovemberBravo 01-25-2020 08:52 AM

Believe it or not Mesa turns people away.

No Land 3 01-25-2020 09:19 AM

Social media presence? Well, that seals it, I'm lucky to be where I am! If Delta took one look at my FB, I'd be on a no-hire list.

sflpilot 01-25-2020 09:27 AM


Originally Posted by NovemberBravo (Post 2964033)
Believe it or not Mesa turns people away.

Everyone talks about the pilot shortage, but as far as right now every regional is still not hiring everyone who applies.

jimpix89 01-25-2020 10:05 AM


Originally Posted by tonsterboy5 (Post 2963972)
Something doesn’t add up. I have a feeling you are not telling the truth, that and never ever downplay anything. When you say you failed “just” your private. You are down playing it. Specifically saying 10% over you are downplaying it.

Saying you got pulled over 2 times in a very short period of time and got a ticket for 10% over I call bs. Maybe that’s what they wrote on the paper but very few places will stop for you for going 5-8 over and give you a ticket every time. Also same goes for a light. You must of really rubbed off wrong on the cops which is the same way you rub off on the interviewer.

pay for interview help to fix how you rub off on people

I think you have a good point. I will remove anything from my application that even smells the slightest bit like a downplay, state everything as matter of fact and if asked about it in the interview, own up to it all. It is my fault at the end of the day after all.

And also take a good look at how I respond to questions with someone else. To me, I think I sound professional, but who knows, maybe there’s something I’m not seeing that someone else could point out before I go interview again.

Mjm8710 01-25-2020 11:11 AM

Sorry to hear about your string of bad luck. I was skimming the replies, and noticed you failed your private. Have you been asked in the interview why you failed? If so, what was the story? Did you own up to it (even if luck wasn’t on your side that day?)

I’m surprised no one really brought this up..interviewers want to know the story and don’t want to hear excuses. They realize sometimes things are out of your control but want to hire someone that’s humble and can admit when they messed something up..

Also goes in line with the question about past emergencies, customer service stories (CFI your students are your customers), and incidences.. any questions like this come up? If so think about how exactly you responded. This also goes for how you responded to your speeding tickets.

Not saying I think this is the reason you weren’t hired, but it’s just another aspect to reflect on about your past interviews.

Anyways, good luck..everyone is hiring right now so keep updating your apps and applying-you’ll land a job somewhere

chrisreedrules 01-25-2020 11:27 AM


Originally Posted by jimpix89 (Post 2964088)
I think you have a good point. I will remove anything from my application that even smells the slightest bit like a downplay, state everything as matter of fact and if asked about it in the interview, own up to it all. It is my fault at the end of the day after all.

And also take a good look at how I respond to questions with someone else. To me, I think I sound professional, but who knows, maybe there’s something I’m not seeing that someone else could point out before I go interview again.

You really should consider having a professional resume/application reviewing company that specializes in these things give your stuff a look. It will cost a little bit of money but the peace of mind will be worth it. And besides, the cost is what? A single premium pay trip once you get that job you’re looking for. Well worth it.

No Land 3 01-25-2020 11:49 AM


Originally Posted by chrisreedrules (Post 2964128)
You really should consider having a professional resume/application reviewing company that specializes in these things give your stuff a look. It will cost a little bit of money but the peace of mind will be worth it. And besides, the cost is what? A single premium pay trip once you get that job you’re looking for. Well worth it.

allegiant told me, "No". I then took an interview prep service and discovered just how out of touch and clueless I really was interviewing. I'll go as far as to say that you should do the interview prep before even going to a job fair. The job fair is where you make first impressions. I was a babbling idiot to the chief pilot at allegiant during the job fair and he was very surprised when he saw me interviewing in Las Vegas. I mean, he is the same guy that took off and couldn't land at destination because of an airshow, but what ever...

senecacaptain 01-25-2020 01:18 PM


Originally Posted by jimpix89 (Post 2962276)
Background.. 1470 hours, clean FAA record, no criminal history, no DUI or anything. I have a 4 year degree with honors from a good university. I’m in my mid 20s. I’ve checked and rechecked my application. Worst thing is that I had a string of bad luck with driving in the last 18 months. I got pulled over 3 times, twice for speeding 10% over the limit (both times they were deferred and dropped from my driving record after 90 days.) I also got nailed during those same traffic stops for having a headlight out and license plates expired. I know, I messed up on these stupid little things but learned from it.

I interviewed with Envoy, showed up prepared with all paperwork and thoroughly studied. Interview went great, was told I was well prepared and did a good job. But 9 days later I got an email saying “we’re sorry, we can’t consider you at this time, apply again in 6 months.

So I applied to Mesa, they called me and I got a phone screen an hour later. It went fine. But then I get the same rejection email 30 minutes later.

I know how to interview because I went through many while trying to get a job out of college and I received offers. I’ve always shown up prepared and well dressed, shoes shined, paperwork in order.

What gives? Im prepared to bring at least 5 if not 10 recommendation letters to my next interview. I’m baffled especially in this hiring environment. Nervous to keep interviewing if this is going to keep happening, possibly closing more doors!

Just curious:

Have you ever been arrested by the police or law enforcement, ever ?

How many checkrides have you failed ?

Any FAA violations or sanctions against you ?

I know you said "clean record" but did any actions such as the above ever get initiated by another agency

jimpix89 01-25-2020 01:23 PM


Originally Posted by senecacaptain (Post 2964197)
Just curious:

Have you ever been arrested by the police or law enforcement, ever ?

How many checkrides have you failed ?

Any FAA violations or sanctions against you ?

No arrest (checked records too in case of a mistaken ID or ID theft) one check ride failure (PPL) and no FAA actions against me or violations.

Im thinking I made some mistakes with my application.

Also, a personal friend of mine with mostly the same clean background was rejected as well. I’m sure we both made mistakes, but they can also afford to be selective at this time which contributed.

senecacaptain 01-25-2020 01:24 PM


Originally Posted by jimpix89 (Post 2964200)
No arrest (checked records too in case of a mistaken ID or ID theft) one check ride failure (PPL) and no FAA actions against me or violations.

Im thinking I made some mistakes with my application.

Also, a personal friend of mine with mostly the same clean background was rejected as well. I’m sure we both made mistakes, but they can also afford to be selective at this time which contributed.

application review should happen

FLT000 01-25-2020 01:38 PM

It was probably the neck and face tattoos.

Excargodog 01-25-2020 04:01 PM

Piercings?

NeverHome 01-25-2020 06:41 PM


Originally Posted by Excargodog (Post 2964261)
Piercings?

Prince Albert is alive and well

Baradium 01-30-2020 11:30 AM


Originally Posted by ItnStln (Post 2967553)
I have a question concerning the SIDA checks. Is the check the same as one would take if they were to work at an airport in a non-fly capacity? If so, does the ability to pass that check mean one would pass the airline’s check for a pilot position?

We can't discuss security protocols or checks.

rickair7777 01-30-2020 01:23 PM


Originally Posted by Baradium (Post 2967558)
We can't discuss security protocols or checks.

We can talk about SIDA in regards to employment aspects, just not actual procedures for accessing secure areas.

ItnStln 01-30-2020 03:23 PM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2967670)
We can talk about SIDA in regards to employment aspects, just not actual procedures for accessing secure areas.

That's what I thought, thanks for the clarification. Is the check the same as one would take if they were to work at an airport in a non-fly capacity? If so, does the ability to pass that check mean one would pass the airline’s check for a pilot position?

captande 01-30-2020 03:35 PM


Originally Posted by ItnStln (Post 2967767)
That's what I thought, thanks for the clarification. Is the check the same as one would take if they were to work at an airport in a non-fly capacity? If so, does the ability to pass that check mean one would pass the airline’s check for a pilot position?

In short, no.

NovemberBravo 01-30-2020 04:26 PM


Originally Posted by ItnStln (Post 2967767)
That's what I thought, thanks for the clarification. Is the check the same as one would take if they were to work at an airport in a non-fly capacity? If so, does the ability to pass that check mean one would pass the airline’s check for a pilot position?

I would assume the port authority or controlling government agency has a different background check process than a airline. I would assume at the minimum FBI background check.

DontLookDown 01-30-2020 04:32 PM

A SIDA check isn’t a secret at all. You can use a quick google search to see what will disqualify someone from having a SIDA badge. The TSA doesn’t care if you’re a burger flipper inside the terminal or a pilot, the same standard applies.

deftone 01-30-2020 07:15 PM


Originally Posted by DontLookDown (Post 2967825)
A SIDA check isn’t a secret at all. You can use a quick google search to see what will disqualify someone from having a SIDA badge. The TSA doesn’t care if you’re a burger flipper inside the terminal or a pilot, the same standard applies.

True, but holding a SIDA doesn’t mean you will pass an airlines background check, which I feel is the question being asked. I guess he has something in the closet that he is worried about?

rickair7777 01-30-2020 07:54 PM

For clarity, airlines will typically do two background checks.

One is the SIDA, which is required by law for 121 crew, period. Some crew get a SIDA badge at their domicile, but most do not these days. Probably the only places that still do that use the SIDA badge to open the gate to the parking lot, or some other logistical access reason. But you get the check regardless of whether or not you get a badge. And if you ever get convicted of a SIDA crime, you're unemployed.

The other is whatever additional HR checks they want (and are allowed by local law) to conduct. Something which is not on the SIDA list could be no-go here, ex, possession of kiddy porn, domestic violence, heroin possession. Some regionals today may only do the required SIDA check, ie they cannot afford to be picky... so you could have a felony and be an airline pilot as long as it's the right felony, and FAA aeromedical gave you a pass on your medical.

Jump pilot 17 01-31-2020 08:57 AM

Do the majors actually care what regional you go to? Or do they just want 121 pic time?

Ciceda 01-31-2020 09:07 AM


Originally Posted by Jump pilot 17 (Post 2968329)
Do the majors actually care what regional you go to? Or do they just want 121 pic time?

They prefer SkyWest Mainline because you already have some Mainline experience coming in.

BigZ 01-31-2020 09:37 AM


Originally Posted by Ciceda (Post 2968337)
They prefer SkyWest Mainline because you already have some Mainline experience coming in.

This. SkyWest E-Jets and the Mainlines basically line up with offers the moment you hit 1000 TPIC

rickair7777 01-31-2020 09:37 AM


Originally Posted by Jump pilot 17 (Post 2968329)
Do the majors actually care what regional you go to? Or do they just want 121 pic time?

No, it generally doesn't matter to the majors. Although if a regional has some sort of very contentious labor issue (ie alter ego operations), you should avoid that because those on the receiving end will hold a grudge for a long time and may eventually end up in a position to influence hiring. There are no such alter-ego regionals at this time, gojets was the last a number of years ago but at this point I doubt many folks would hold a grudge against a current gojets pilot.

rickair7777 01-31-2020 09:37 AM


Originally Posted by Ciceda (Post 2968337)
They prefer SkyWest Mainline because you already have some Mainline experience coming in.


Originally Posted by BigZ (Post 2968359)
This. SkyWest E-Jets and the Mainlines basically line up with offers the moment you hit 1000 TPIC

For clarity, this is sarcasm.

itsmytime 01-31-2020 04:53 PM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2968361)
For clarity, this is sarcasm.


its a a shame you had to clarify that.

CLE to IAH 01-31-2020 08:23 PM


Originally Posted by No Land 3 (Post 2968766)
I don'ts.

can you elaborate as to what you think a “sky nazi” is and why that is an appropriate thing to post?

Green Needles 01-31-2020 08:43 PM

The OP should consider Endeavor. We're getting pretty desperate over here from what I understand.

havick206 01-31-2020 09:03 PM


Originally Posted by No Land 3 (Post 2968766)
I don't know.

I’m far from being an Envoy cheerleader, but your post is nonsensical. An Envoy Pilot has flow but can also apply anywhere else too. Most pilots are too lazy to have apps out but there’s nothing stopping them doing so.

No Land 3 02-01-2020 02:53 AM


Originally Posted by havick206 (Post 2968787)
I’m far from being an Envoy cheerleader, but your post is nonsensical. An Envoy Pilot has flow but can also apply anywhere else too. Most pilots are too lazy to have apps out but there’s nothing stopping them doing so.

Some of it is ridiculous, but notice that no one refuted the claim that Envoy pilots have no respect for Mesa, and that they would prevent them from being hired at AA if they could.

rickair7777 02-01-2020 06:02 AM


Originally Posted by CLE to IAH (Post 2968771)
can you elaborate as to what you think a “sky nazi” is and why that is an appropriate thing to post?

Historically AA (mainline) pilots were referred to facetiously as "sky nazis" due the perception of having a rather stiff corporate and flight ops culture. This did not apply to eagle to my knowledge, and is now probably not very relevant since AA is really AWA DB AA, and is manned by cactus and airways pilots in addition to legacy AA.

havick206 02-01-2020 07:25 AM


Originally Posted by No Land 3 (Post 2968833)
Some of it is ridiculous, but notice that no one refuted the claim that Envoy pilots have no respect for Mesa, and that they would prevent them from being hired at AA if they could.

Thats also bogus.

NovemberBravo 02-01-2020 08:57 AM


Originally Posted by No Land 3 (Post 2968833)
Some of it is ridiculous, but notice that no one refuted the claim that Envoy pilots have no respect for Mesa, and that they would prevent them from being hired at AA if they could.

This is true.

rickair7777 02-01-2020 11:09 AM


Originally Posted by havick206 (Post 2968963)
Thats also bogus.


Originally Posted by NovemberBravo (Post 2969032)
This is true.

They probably would if they could. But they probably can't.

Probably. But I know of at least one for sure, maybe two cases where a former regional pilot got involved in hiring at a major and brought his regional intramural prejudices with him. The one for sure basically went scorched-earth against his hated enemies until he was involuntarily removed from those duties.

havick206 02-01-2020 12:19 PM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2969090)
They probably would if they could. But they probably can't.

Probably. But I know of at least one for sure, maybe two cases where a former regional pilot got involved in hiring at a major and brought his regional intramural prejudices with him. The one for sure basically went scorched-earth against his hated enemies until he was involuntarily removed from those duties.

There’s outliers everywhere.


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