Gojets
 

What is the story on Gojets? I got a call yesterday from HR to schedule an interview. Whats the history of the company? I did a search on them, however it didn't turn up much info? Do they hire straight into the left seat? Their info lists flight time requirements for captain as well as FO.

gotta be joking me that you haven't found information on GoJets yet, if you're asking about them hiring straight into the left seat, i'd assume you don't have enough time to get that seat anyway, or atleast you're not prior 121.

Honestly, you don't want to work there, terrible work rules, terrible contract, a company that can give you a day off when you're "on the road" but doesn't have to bring you home, and therefore could fly you forever as long as they don't break FAA work rules.

They're an alter ego carrier, started up to get around a scope clause at Trans States Airlines, they have the same management as TSA, same training center, different certificate, different senority list, and aren't really liked by a good chunk of the regional pilots out there. End result, you go to go jet, you leave, get hired on at a major, as do all the people from everywhere else in the industry. While at gojet, you are hounded by other airline pilots (those that will talk to you) when you leave, they ask where you came from, and they remember that you were a go jet pilot, and hound you again. Not really worth it, i don't believe in that "they'll never get another 121 job" thing, but they'll be suffering in the next one, and the one after that, and after that...

Anyone really nice to freedom A guys yet?

Here we go again.....

I'm no expert on the subject, but be very careful about that place. You should be able to do a search on them, it's been discussed numerous times on these boards. I'll try to explain in a nutshell:

GoJets was basically created to sort of 'undercut' the guys at Trans States, so the management wouldn't have to worry about contract issues with any eligible TSA pilots. It's known as an alter-ego airline of TSA, and most pilots on these boards and most you will talk to will say going to work there is borderline making you a scab. However it does appear that some of those pilots are getting hired at some of the majors from what I've read. Just be careful, maybe go for the interview experience, but do a lot of research and I'm sure you'll find some more useful information. As far as more practical information about the company, I don't know a whole lot, there is probably some info on the main APC page.

Ok well flynavy beat me to it haha, looks like you explained in a bit more detail too...

Loooong sigh....here we go again...

There are previous GoJets threads here on APC. They are hard to read because there is a great deal of anger mixed in. I'll summarize to hopefully save you some trouble:

Do Not work for GoJets...they are the next best thing to scabs. You will definately carry a stigma for the rest of your career, and you might be denied employment later on.

Are you familiar with the Mesa / Freedom A debacle? If so, gojets is just like Freedom A, that is to say an alter-ego airline. An alter-ego is not "fair market competition", it is an airline-within-an-airline that exists to get around the union contract of the existing airline. Most union contracts have a scope clause that prevents this sort of thing, but Mesa and TSA didn't have strong enough language.

Basically GoJets was created and used by management because they couldn't get TSA to agree to fly larger RJ's for cheap. So they created a "new" airline and started replacing TSA flying with gojets airplanes. Some gojets pilots voluntarily came over from TSA...this allowed them to jump seniority to a quicker upgrade while those still at TSA suffered the loss of flying.

Again don't do it if you have any self-respect, or hope for any respect from your peers. If in doubt, go to ORD terminals E & F...you'll see a bunch of furtive looking pilots hiding out in the back corners of unused gate areas. You'll also notice that when they walk around their badges are turned around so they can't be easily identified as gojets. They are afraid to show their faces in any of the ORD crew rooms...their behavior alone tells you that they are ashamed of what they do, and they know it's wrong. Is that how you want to spend your regioanl career? Hiding from other pilots?

GoJet's pilots are hated by other pilots. They are hated very much, and many people consider them the next worst things to scabs.

Have you ever taken a gun and just shot yourself in the foot to see what it feels like?? That is essentially what you will be doing if you go fly for GoJet, aka Blow Jets, Gayway, Goaway Jets, etc...

GoJet was created by Trans States. They wanted their pilots to fly 70 seat jets, but Trans States scope clause said they could not fly bigger airplanes unless a pay rate was negotiated. Instead of negotiating, Trans States went around the pilots contract and created GoJet's. They got the jets. People were hired there and "upgraded" out of seniority order over Trans States pilots. Not only were Trans States pilots screwed in that sense, but many were furloughed at this time. Usually this is against US Labor Laws, but somehow Trans States was able to circumvent these laws. That is the story (more or less).

GoJet's pilots are hated by all. Their is no discriminating. Every GoJet pilot is hated equally. Many will not allow you ride on their airplane (in jumpseat or even in back). You had better live in Saint Louis, or within close driving distance. Otherwise, I don't see how you are going to get to work.
If you ever want to go to another airline, you will have a hard time answering, "So why did you fly at GoJet's?" Be ready for people ignoring/not talking to you in future jobs. Only speak when spoken to, and only when absolutely necessary for the safe operation of the flight.

GoJet's only has about 150 pilots. Having that small of a group makes it easy to keep tabs on you. There used to be a list of all GoJet's pilots that was published (to use to deny GoJet's pilots from riding jumpseats), but I can't seem to find it. It was something like gojetpilots.com.

Anyway, there are very good reasons not to go and work for GoJet's. You may be committing career suicide. There are plenty of other regionals out there. They are hiring thousands of pilots this year. They are lowering minimums every single day. You WILL get hired by another carrier soon. Do not take the job at GoJet!!!
But hey, if you want to shoot yourself in the foot (by going to GoJet), let me know how it feels. I sure as hell don't want to try it.

Feel free to ask more questions to fully understand the implications of your choice.
Good luck making the right choice.
Ryan

Don't go there!!!!!!!

Bad place to work...

END OF THREAD. Thanks.

There are people who would disagree.... but this has all been sound advice. Avoid GoatJets like the plague! While they're not scabs by the technical definition, they're not really respected by other pilot groups at the regional level. Hold out for a better company, you'll thank yourself later.

You'll hear people claim that the majors don't care where you come from. I disagree with that. A few of my friends work at FDX, CAL, AS and SWA- and they all had nothing but bad things to say about GoJets. Don't buy into the hype their HR people try to sell you. At the end of the day, they still willingly undercutted their TSA brothers... and the people at the larger carriers know that very well.

I'm Glad you're take our advice. GoJets and Mesa are two places that one should not work, there are others but these two are #1 (GoJets) & #2 (Mesa) on the bottom of the barrel. BUT if I had to choose, I'd rather have a Mesa pilot next to me than a GoJeter.

Take care and best of luck in your future endeavors.

F@#K BlowJets!

To sum up the last 7 post:

gojets = alter ego scab operation, selfish backstabbing individuals detested by the whole industry. STAY AWAY!

You hit the nail precisely on the head... I'm buying the beers. :D

go up to the top and click "search" and put in gojets or "blowjets"...same company.

GoJet Pilot = Don't do that to yourself OR your career.

Ive got the time to go to the left seat. I just lost my corporate job so no 121 time. A little 135 time from 10 years ago.

I haven't been anywhere near the airline side of aviation for about 10 years. However, I have had it with the corporate side. So, with no contacts in the airline side, I am starting out pretty fresh. 6100TT/3500ME/2100Turbine Part25 Aircraft.

GoJets was just the first company to call back.

the way it went down
 

This is true :mad:
The only thing I did not understand was if our scope limited us from flying over 50 seats...why were we operating an ATR-72 for AA connection? :confused:
Also...why did we get to "vote" on one list and secure the flying? I know it was a bad deal with the 3 year extension and the GO (HOME) JET guys keeping their seats...but HOW COULD WE EVEN VOTE ON IT IF IT WAS NOT ALLOWED?
O'h...back the original question...DONT GO THERE HAHAHA...the CRJ guy taxing behind me could barely speak English :eek: ...just a nice touch.

If a 350 pound prostitute with every VD known to man was the first to call on a Friday night, you wouldn't hop in the sack with her, would ya?

I'd hold out.

the AA scope clause at TSA limits jet aircraft to 50 seats or less, the pilots did get a chance to vote on flying the CRJ under the new certificate, combined pilot lists though, but i believe pay was the main concern and it was voted down, thinking that pay would be negotiated. Instead, a separate pilot list was built, separate company, and the initial "no union" was a real kicker to boot.

With the amount of time you have, i'd hold out for something better, heck, trans states would hire you, and you'd be in the left seat well out of senority, unfortunately, you'd be on reserve for years to come.

I wouldn't say that necessarily working for GoJets would black list you from the majors. I just saw one of our newhires came from GoJets as a matter of fact. Don't know anything else about him (such as the number and quality of recs he had).

Sure, there are much better regional and 135 jobs out there. But my opinion is that working for GJ won't in and of itself cost you a job at a major... or at least at Brown. :)

There was a reason for that.

Under your circumstances, I would probably go to the interview, just to get the practice. That way you'll be better prepared when someone who you do want to work for calls. Did you try SKW? They have no problem hiring relatively high time people, and they are having trouble filling clases right now.

[QUOTE=cl601pilot;173458I did a search on them, however it didn't turn up much info?[/QUOTE]
You must not know how to search for something AT ALL.

Try This!
 

cl601pilot, why not send your resume to CAL, DAL, VA, SkyBus, etc. One, if not a few will come calling with your times. I'm not saying that VA or SkyBus are great places but they do have new seniority list so if they take off then so will your career. Sounds like you have nothing to lose.

Hope you didn't get used to eating when you were at your corporate gig.

Skybus: $65,000 salaried for A319 CAPTAIN! $30,000 for FOs.
VA: $95/hr for A319/320 CAPTAIN! $44/hr for FOs. Merit-based upgrade (whatever that means. I bet their workrules are industry-leading too:rolleyes: )

YGTBSM! You'll make more than that at most good regionals such as XJT and SkyWest and upgrade at both places is 2 years or less. For what its worth, I am on pace to break $30,000 second year at XJT flying a lowly "R"J.

Sure, but those are starting wages for CA and FO. Look at most all the Majors and Legacies, you'll see about the same pay scale. $25 (US Airways)-$54 (SWA) an hour for first yr FO's and once you upgrade you'll make between $90-#130 an hour based upon yrs with Co. The pay is not what it used to be, I agree, but if you start at $95/hr at VA you'll probably top out around $145-$160/hr (around JB pay range). You can't make that at ANY regional unless you're one of the few employed as sim instructor. If he goes to SKW or XJT then he's stuck with 2 yrs (est.) FO pay ($19-$23 first yr and $34-$35 second) and a starting CA pay around $60-$65/hr (2-3 yr). DAL FO pay beats RJ CA pay when you compare 3 yr RJ CA (60-65) to 2 yr Maddog FO pay ($68). Top out as an RJ CA around $95-$105 (18yrs) and top out DAL FO at $129 (12yrs) while on your way to CA in the mid to upper 100's.

Just numbers, but I'd take the chance if I had his numbers.

I'm currently making over $4000 a month on second year FO pay. I fly mainly CR7/9's and make an average of $36.75/hr with the 5% block override. I block around 85 hours and credit about 97-100 hours of pay with about 300 TAFB/mth.

97 hrs x $36.75 = $3565
300 hrs x $1.6 = $480

$460 + $3565 = $4045/mth x 12 mths = $48,540.

Sure I'll take some vacation, call in sick, holidays, B-Days, etc; but I should end up well into the mid 40's. Not bad for 2nd year pay at the regionals, and yes I know we deserve more but we are just codeshares flying with thin margins.

This is not a pi$$ing contest about who "Root" is larger, just adding my numbers

All the companies are slitting each others throats at the expense of their workers. GoJets just took it to a level we haven't seen in a couple years.

Well I'm not sold on those numbers. I haven't seen official pay scales and who knows what the work rules will be. According to APC VA pilots get a $5/hr raise each year. That would put their 12 year pay for CAs at $155/hr. Using pax 737/A32X fleets and 12yr CA for comparison, heres where VA would fall among other operators just looking at hourly rates:

SWA $198/hr
AA $161/hr
VA $155/hr
AS $154/hr
AT $153/hr
FNT $152/hr
DAL $151/hr
JB $147/hr
CAL $144/hr
AWA $138/hr
NWA $137/hr
UAL $133/hr
SPT $130/hr
USA $125/hr

With a pay scale like that and a supposedly LCC business model either they are printing their own money, have found a cheap alternative to jet A and are not telling anyone or their work rules are not user friendly. Again, just some numbers I tossed around for comparison. Something doesn't seem quite right to me.

I'm not talking about work rules, that's a whole other beast. How are you not sold, your numbers above are argue my point for me. With his hours why not give VA, DAL and CAL a shot. If he wants to just work as a line pilot flying just over guarantee then he'll make more money at the Majors/Legacies than he will at the regionals. That is, unless he works his ass off as a 18yr RJ CA, maybe then he'll reach the $125,000+/yr pay range.

Don't forget that DAL, CAL, AA, NWA, SWA, UAL, UPS, FedEx, ABx, Astar and many others 2nd-18th yr FO pay scale tops our CA's rates at the regionals; and their just FO's.

its true.....your career will end at up Fed Ex, UPS, Continental, Delta, Jet Blue....those are just a few of the places those scumbags are ending up....sucks to be them....those lists are ruining their lives! hahahaha

p.s..... a Jetblue pilot ( former TSA ) was just FIRED for having his little list and harrasing a few pilots at an open house....do some homework here....its true....have fun with your little lists.....looks like the door will be hitting YOU and your list in the ass on the way out! Looks like his little plan fell apart all around him....so sad.... sssssseeya!

yep, he did a not so smart thing of totally ripping a couple go jet guys apart in public, and end result was his termination at jet blue. Sux, but that's what happens when you get all worked up. Like i said (and others have too) Go Jet guys ARE getting major airline jobs just like everyone else is, they have guys at FedEX and UPS like everyone else also, i just wouldn't want GOJET sitting around on my resume' for the rest of my life, along with having people ask me time and time again to justify why i went to them in the first place. The real damage i think, is that EVERYONE is getting major airline jobs, EVERYONE from EVERY regional will be there, and theres NO REGIONAL that actually condones GOJET, and as a result, you'll be finding a lot of future bitter people, more than the ones who are already there.

That wasn't very smart of them.

Hypothetically speaking, If I had the inclination and opportunity to sabotage a gojetter's career it would happen behind closed doors on the DL...the gojetter would never even know what hit him. Hypothetically speaking.

Of course I might never have the opportunity, who knows. :)

That guy quit on me during block-in after Leg One of a four-day...I didn't even have the fasten seat belts sign off after parking at the gate when he looked at me and said "I quit." He Jumpseated back home and left us and the Pax delayed until a RSV was called up.

Which guy quit? Why did he quit?

My point was that the pay doesn't tell the whole story. And I never said don't apply to DAL or CAL or where ever (although CAL's work rules and pay are disgusting). VA or any other airline may have great hourly pay but horrible work rules. At which point its a wash and you may even lose a little depending on what you value your time at. And who knows what that is going to be like at these places like VA and SkyBus. My point was that VA can't have or keep industry leading pay with the type of operation they are proposing without something else going on (horrible work rules, making crews pay for the hotels, etc). So you can make all you want out of hourly rates but it doesn't mean jack if your flight cancels and you have no cancellation pay (pretty sure 0 hours at $95/hr comes out to...$0!:eek: ) or you gotta shell out for a hotel room at the overnight. And what good is money if you can't spend any of it or your time with your friends and family because your airline is not required to give you your days off in your domicile?

It sounds like our guy who started the thread is at least mid 30s-40s just based on his experience. If I was in that position I think the better option would be to get on with a good regional, accrue seniority quickly so you can get those 18 and 19 day off lines, still make $95-115K flying and do something else I enjoy on the side (there are, in fact, other ways to make money besides flying). And be able to spend those days off at home with friends and family or travelling or whatever else I wanted to do, not sitting alone in a hotel room in a strange city.

I guess the whole point we ALL are trying to make is choose wisely. In this current hiring environment and with those qualifications there are many many options besides GoJets and crappy upstarts.

the former JetBlue guy they were talking about in the previous post...! Quit because JetBlue left him a VM saying he was hired...

Freez, you and I have had this conversation(about QOL, Pay & Work Rules) many times so you should know by now that I understand every bit of it. For the most part you and I are on the same page so why the? Besides, name one Regional/Major/Legacy airline that doesn't have some sort of cancellation pay policy and doesn't pay for hotels. Your examples are extremes but I already get the point that you're making and I agree. Money isn't everything but with all things understood, I'd take the job at DAL.

Good Day!

Freez, you and I have had this conversation(about QOL, Pay & Work Rules) many times so you should know by now that I understand every bit of it. For the most part you and I are on the same page so why the? Besides, name one Regional/Major/Legacy airline that doesn't have some sort of cancellation pay policy and doesn't pay for hotels. Your examples are extremes, I understand the point that you're making and I agree, but I would've focused on Trip/Duty Rigs and QOL. Money isn't everything but with all things understood, I'd take the job at DAL.

Good Day!

This is total FLAMEBAIT and you all fell for it....

I you actual applied to GoJet and they called you....you would know that there is NO s in GoJet...

Hook-- Line-- and Sinker--

You all played right in

<----------see avatar

"I you actual applied to GoJet and they called you....you would know that there is NO s in GoJet..."

Or, it could be a slight mistake in semantics, grammer, or spelling. Kinda like the one you made in your attempt to form a sentence.