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Old 01-02-2008 | 02:46 AM
  #21  
meeko031's Avatar
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Originally Posted by SaltyDog
Respect is earned and a two way street. Courtesy is afforded to each as we are professionals.
Who is more of a risk? You who are gaining some experience or a Capt who allows an "unsafe"approach? Ans: The Capt is the bigger risk because he/she lacks the brass to act like a Captain. If you ever feel uncomfortable with an approach, you should take it around. That is covered in our cockpit CRM brief on my flights (anyone uncomfortable, we take it around and talk later). Fortunately, our company has a no fault go around policy. All the more reason to let you fly a few more legs. Anyone can get behind the 8 ball on an approach, lots of reasons. Important is recognition it is going "unsafe" and go around. Here is an example with Santa Ana winds in ONT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow96L...9E862C&index=3

you're right! I should've considered a go-around but I had the plane under control, on speed, and on the glideslope.....It's not an excuse but I know Im not the first nor will be the last not going around at that point!(I still have lots of learning to do) On a lighter note my approach was not as unstable as the link you posted... hahaha
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Old 01-02-2008 | 04:09 AM
  #22  
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From: Executive Transport Driver
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Originally Posted by meeko031
you're right! I should've considered a go-around but I had the plane under control, on speed, and on the glideslope.....It's not an excuse but I know Im not the first nor will be the last not going around at that point!(I still have lots of learning to do) On a lighter note my approach was not as unstable as the link you posted... hahaha
Meek-

One thing that you can do to alleviate a captains concerns in such an event is to make sure that you are both on the same page when it's actually happening-

I have no problem with deviating from standard profiles when operations dictate it's necessary. In fact, odds are that every flight crew deviates from standard in some manner everyday- it's simply a fact of life. (Ever notice how when you fly with somebody from training who absolutely must fly the book exactly, things just don't go quite as smoothly?)

Like I said- I have no problem with such deviations, as long as we keep each other in the loop! Gonna stay clean and fast to the marker because we're late? Okay- lemme know and prebrief it so that I don't get nervous. Want to climb out at 200 knots to 10000' because of low level level windshear or the fact we're flying in the wrong direction? Let me know that too.

When you're flying an approach that's on the ragged edge of stablity (at least per the book), let the other guy know that you know things aren't quite normal, but you have it under control. For example, as simple statement like- "I'm a bit high and fast right now, but I'll have it stabilized and spooled by 1000 AGL (or 500 AGL, whichever your company uses), or we'll go around" can alleviate a lot of stress the other guy might be having about your approach.

Finally, don't consider post flight debriefs as a bad thing. Any time I flew as an FO, I always appreciated things captains told me that I could improve upon (and often asked for suggestions about technique). As a captain, I try to find at least one or two things that I can offer suggestions about (in a friendly and mentoring manner of course).
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Old 01-02-2008 | 09:04 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by FlyerJosh
You should have asked her some other inane question like, "How would we get off the plane if you ever had a heart attack?"

(Or just said- "Dunno. They don't train us for that... let's just hope it never happens!")
Actually I said we would be in trouble because I am only trained in takeoffs, not landings.
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Old 01-02-2008 | 05:50 PM
  #24  
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From: B-717 FO / C-17 AC
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flyerjosh is right. nothing is scarier than when somebody deviates from the norm without announcing that they are either doing it on purpose, or know that theyve deviated and are correcting. it makes the other pilot feel uncomfortable because they think that you are going to get them in trouble. If you ever have the luxury of flying with a flight engineer, this will become even more obvious to you. at any rate, just because you have an iffy approach doesnt mean the captain wont let you fly half the legs. hell still let you fly, but hell want to see that the first time was just a fluke. enjoy.
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Old 01-03-2008 | 07:18 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by POPA
For some reason, I fly the first leg and then nothing else for the rest of the trip. I haven't figured out why!
lol. Now that's funny ....
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Old 01-03-2008 | 07:39 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by The Juice
I am just a "co-pilot" and we dont fly, we are there to observe for a few years and them right before upgrade we have magic dust sprinkled on us and then we are able to fly.

I know people who are more likely to believe this than an FO flying the plane. I had a FA ask me how we would land if the CA had a heart attack in flight. i explained that I would land to which she replied, "but you are not a pilot yet."
I once had a pax ask me as I was commuting to work: "So, are you the captain?"
Me: "No, first officer." (In uniform, wearing 3 bars)
Pax: "Oh...<long pause>...So do you fly the airplane if the captain needs to go use the bathroom?"

*sigh*
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Old 01-03-2008 | 07:44 PM
  #27  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined: Apr 2007
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From: E170 FO
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Originally Posted by NightIP
I once had a pax ask me as I was commuting to work: "So, are you the captain?"
Me: "No, first officer." (In uniform, wearing 3 bars)
Pax: "Oh...<long pause>...So do you fly the airplane if the captain needs to go use the bathroom?"

*sigh*
My response would've been the same one I use when the FAs ask who is flying...."George."
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Old 01-04-2008 | 05:36 AM
  #28  
New Hire
 
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Depends on the FO if he/she is a good person then he/she gets half or more of the legs. If he/she is arrogant or ****es off the captain then he/she may not get any legs.
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Old 01-04-2008 | 09:19 AM
  #29  
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Talking

Originally Posted by POPA
For some reason, I fly the first leg and then nothing else for the rest of the trip. I haven't figured out why!
try flying the plane upright....maybe that'll earn you more legs to fly! hahahaha
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Old 01-04-2008 | 09:42 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by meeko031
on a short approach, I managed to leave the plane high and fast but managed to slow it down vapp before 500ft. I landed in the touchdown zone and in the centerline. Once we landed he talked to me while I was doing my postflight and said that was an unsafe approach. I just nodded, apologized and agreed! (give him the respect that he needs being the captain)

I don't think I'll be flying alot this month with this captain im paired with.

You work for XJ or somebody else?
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