:eek:
no way!?!
:eek:

... and I was so counting on those 'permanent' routes of ours to fund my pension:confused:

Copy that... roger wilco

ASA is like Chuck Norris... we get cleared for runway 37 all day long.:cool:

:p







....sry had to do it:D

When Chuck Norris flies the altimeter setting is 00.00. Chuck Norris is never under pressure.

LOL sry, I really do hate the Chuck Norris jokes so I'm not sure why I just posted this....

ya i heard the same, we are fat on off season and tinkering just about right on busy ones. so to save furloughs woulda/shoulda hit a few months ago.

I've heard this a couple of times, but how would it hurt the company to furlough pilots and then bring them back in May if needed? It also seems to me we will still be fat come spring when the flying picks up.

I was in the November 5th class, which was the next-to-last class before the new contract so I am "technically" can't be furloughed. I do stress technically and my question is that if furloughs were to happen, how much is this clause really worth? I agree that if we were going to furlough it would have already happened by now but just some food for thought.

I was told because of the cost of getting us back and sending us back to sims for recurrent and a few days of ground would cost the company more. But I also was told that if you are furloughed for less then 3 months then under 121 you can just go back to the line right away. Not sure.... :confused:

Are you all on drugs?

Possibly, what do you know that we don't?

No I only do drugs on my off days... Dont want the TSA to get me...

JP can you give up some more info on the F-bomb? Lets talk numbers...

To all that have been F-ed but didn't make the cut, do they reduce line numbers as well? Is it just like a cut to the number of Reserve pilots? Curious cause I would speculate that I would be close to the line...

~m

Good question!! I'm prob in the same boat as you...

Not really sure myself - I was thinking that if they sent out letters now, they could bring a lot us back in steps come spring when our recurrent ground and our PC is due anyway. I can't imagine that would cost anything for them or that they would be required to do any more than that. Dunno though.

I’d have to side with Pennekamp on this one. I think your living in denial if you think we’ve safely passed through the potential furlough window. I heard the company would be having high level meeting with Big-D in late October or early November. I was told the current pilot surplus (which I heard is around 150 to 200 pilots) is going to be on top of their list for discussion. If the outcome of these meeting is not good, it might be a week or two before it filters down to us, and this would be more in-line with Pennekamp remarks.

I know our contract has language protecting us from the ‘F’ word, but I’m also sure Delta and Sky West Inc. have plenty of well paid lawyers who can find crafty ways around this if need be.

haha I don't know also and (like you probubly) I don't want to find out the hard way. Truth is, ASA has never done it and there is no obviouse signs that they will. Lots of ppl are taking COMAs and we may just be worried about nothing. I would sleep better if I knew what was going on but unless one of us is managment we just have to press on. :o

Well if you are right, there is nothing we can do about it. Just do what we can to keep our numbers high and maybe that can lead to more lines. (dreaming) Other then that, it is out of ALL of our hands. I chose to come to ASA and not another regional and John is right, if I get f..ed I may change my tone but as of now ASA hasn't given me a reason to doubt them. If they do F..ed me I will just wait to get recalled. Don't see why I wouldn't by summer flying so I get a few months of vacation. haha just to make a bad situation look a little better.

There are about 120 of us that the contract does not protect. There's also about 160 of us who are on probation still and that they could just release if they were feeling nasty. We're fair game and we know it! :( While I'm hoping that ASA will stick to never furloughing, I also came into this industry with the expectation that I will be furloughed a couple of times.

Like daniel, I'd just like to know, one way or another.

we "lost" our "exotic" flying becasue we don't have "first class" sections on our planes....why don't we have "first class" seats on our planes? you ask.....WELL, I think that issue has been beaten into the ground but, just for good measure.....ASA-ALPA.

Don't blame ASA-ALPA for SkyWest's decision to engage in self help. Would you have preferred a pay cut in order to undercut SkyWest's pilots?

SkyWest did strip ASA's pre-existing orders. Be angry at Jerry for that.

LMAO Linda Richmond anybody???

Good old coffee talk...

Rhode Island is neither a road nor an island, discuss:p

Since nobody else has brought it up, I'll ask.

If ASA was offered this next batch of 9 or so 900's, if they agreed to drop 2 for 1 50 seaters........why did Mesaba get the 900's without having to make the same deal. Anotherwords, why did ASA only have to agree to dump 50's to get 90's, but Mesaba just got the airplanes? This makes no sense to me! Either they want to get rid of some 50's, or they don't. Even more peculiar, ASA has a base in ATL, and has extra pilots on the roster (doing nothing and getting paid) while Mesaba will have to hire for this operation, and start a whole new setup in ATL (which has to be somewhat costly).

The whole thing makes no sense.


PS. I totally agree that ASA is just hanging on and hoping D throws something their way, and if nothing materializes soon, they will be forced to 'right size' the work force! There is NO WAY it makes good business sense to carry so many extra employees in tight economic times.

I think these 900s came with new lines. The ASA deal was crappy... 5:1 and I don't even think it came with an increase in lines and if it did, not many. Just 900 flying old 200 lines and in less frequency. Out of all the 900s deals I think the last one would have helped out ASA the most.

Maybe this will be good for ASA ?

Nobody said the new 900s would be operated in ATL.

Wrong! Jerry said that if we didn't get serious about the contract, it would be "economically unfeasible" to place the -900s at ASA. ASA-ALPA told him to pack sand, so he gave them to SkyWest. They (and the pilots who supported them in chest-thumping) ARE to blame!

It's never too late.

If you want private evidence, don't ask or JP won't hear private evidence any more.

If you want public evidence, look at Charlie's memo last week talking about reductions in Flight Ops management and "no growth in the foreseeable future". Read between the lines on that. How long do you think Delta will pay for ASA's pilot surplus? As said, meetings ARE being held this month now that the merger is out of the way. Look for an announcement right before Christmas one way or the other.

My prediction is that Delta takes 30-40 of our -200s by force (the ones they own) and gives us 10-15 -900s. And we furlough the extra pilots who won't be needed now. By the way, that's not growth. It's a net loss of 20-25 planes at 5 crews per plane. Do the math. Pretty close to 150 pilots.

Also Mesaba WILL have an ATL Saab base with 15 airplanes flying everything less than 300 miles from ATL.

Some people make statements with some REAL confidence. I'm not saying they are right/wrong but I can go back to some posts that people made and man, they were way off. We should charge 10 bucks to eveyone and anyone who makes a prediction or strong statement and it never becomes valid. Then again this place would be pretty boring without all that rumor action. Still you could make some good money;)

I see dead people.

I agree:D, no one is Nostradamus. Some of the stuff on here make for good opinion based reading, thats all i look at it as.

That would make sense if there wasn't this whole 80% rule. If that somehow goes out the window then I'll start believing the negativity:D

However you are completely correct about the SKW 900s. I've spoken to many ASA captains that have been around a while and I heard we SERIOUSLY dropped the ball on that one. "Chest thumping" is the exact phrase many of them quote.

Now we cry with every 900 we see awarded to another regional while we see our sister regional operate 17 900s in ATL 5 million miles from their next closet base. Oh the irony....

What is this 'anotherwords' phrase you speak of?

Holy @()#! a level-headed post. I truly cant believe what I am reading.

Those orders were "placed" before the acquisition of ASA. ASA was the first to get the 900's paperwork in and the press releases had all been made. Those jets were diverted to punish ASA pilots for not taking a cram down that cut some pilots (the IP's) pay by as much as 50%. Jerry was quoted saying some ASA pilots were earning TWICE as much as they should. It is hard to accept the notion of pay cuts while your airline is making record profits.

Don't forget that Mesaba is a wholly owned. Putting airplanes there helps increase the value of that asset. If SkyWest wants them for SkyWest, or ASA, they are going to have to buy them. (and I think there will be an attempted sale of Mesaba and Compass for reasons that are outside the scope of this thread)

I don't know ASA's numbers, but they're probably similar to Comair. Here are the Comair seniority numbers...

At Mesaba 1.5 years gets you the left seat. At Comair it gets you Furloughed. Looks like Delta has a preference on seniority vs cost.

Here's the piece of the puzzle you're missing. JA and Delta will renegotiate the contract, and JA will give up the 80% in exchange for no longer having to be second from the bottom in operating cost. This will pave the way.

I'm not Nostradamus. I'm not having revelations, I'm talking to lots of people in the know, and putting the puzzle together to make an educated prediction.

Yep!

The 80% clause will be gone, or changed soon. (BTW, nobody has ever determined if the 80% includes the SKYW planes)

I agree with JP on another point, the 30-40 200's Delta owns will soon be gone, however, I disagree that ASA will get any 900's in return. That ship has sailed out of the harbor and ASA missed the boat. You all keep forgetting that Delta is still intending to eliminate 100 CRJ200's from their portfolio. Where are these coming from??? The 40 Delta owns is a great start. If you can't open your eyes and see that ASA is slowly being squeezed out of ATL, our one and only hub/base, then you have blinders on! Every day, a new carrier is replacing old ASA routes. Our ATR turboprop fleet is being replaced by Mesaba Saabs.

The new year will bring many interesting changes........

Cost is King, and ASA loses out in that!

ASA was offered 900's recently but we turned down the offer because it came at a 2 50's for 1 900 deal so management passed on that one.

Again on the 2 for 1.........I don't buy it.

Wasn't ASA awfully close to the 80% ATL flying before we lost all our ATR flying? So, eliminate the ATR's and eliminate 10 more 50's, wouldn't that put ASA below the 80% mark?

Not to mention, Delta can just take away 40 50 seaters that they own without asking permission.

Delta will take aircraft away from any partner, and give the replacements to anybody they want.

Also, if the deal was a 2 for 1 on 900's for 200's, why doesn't Mesaba or Pinnacle have to eliminate 200's everytime they are awarded new aircraft like ASA was told they would have to????

Whipsaw, lies and smokescreens!

I'm confused as to how Delta pays for ASA's pilot surplus. Isn't that a cost that ASA would have to absorb?