Airline Pilot Central Forums - Mesa Air Group Settles Aloha Lawsuit

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- - Mesa Air Group Settles Aloha Lawsuit (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/33956-mesa-air-group-settles-aloha-lawsuit.html)

DENpilot you are not worth what you make, you might as well work for free or pay for your job if you have that attitude.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DENpilot (Post 509267)

Fair. I'm not standing up for or condemning the actions of management. I'm happy where I stand and I have no desire to get tied up in a fight with mgmt when I am happy. I won't hinder you from your fight with them, but don't blame me for just having job and earning a living.

Thank you.:) I wish you the best & am glad you have a job. Especially with the looming great D 2.0. But when possible fight for more that's all.

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Originally Posted by TurboFan (Post 508239)

I really think that it is ignorance and hatred like this that tears our industry apart. So many of you can't see through the b.s. to fact that we're all pilots just trying to wring a drop of quality of life out of an industry that has taken and taken from us. As of now there is NO regional I can think of that treats pilots the way we deserve to be treated. Those of you who want to hate and grovel about this regional or that regional are missing the big picture. Pilots need to wage a war against all regional management in order to succeed, not a war between pilots. The longer you focus your energy on hating your fellow pilots, the further this industry will fall.

Unfortunately, pilots are their own worst enemy. Its going to take some sacrifice by everyone to improve the fee for departure carriers. But pilots with who cannot see past their "whats in it for me right now" attitude find it hard to see the big picture. The FFD Task Force is working behind the scenes to make things better. You should look into it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 508925)

It is your fault that others are furloughed man! Mesa does ruin lives! As you say, we live in a capitalistic society. You're right! So for every dollar less per hour, fewer days off per month and harder you work for Mesa, you do undercut your fellow pilots that you 'oh so wish we could unite together'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 508925)

When you jumpseat on other regionals, they are not going to tell you off to your face about who you work for. That would be unprofessional. What you don't see is what we are thinking.

What YOU are thinking maybe. Dude, I'm no spring chicken to this industry. I have many, many friends outside of Mesa and have done my share of jumpseating. I've yet to have someone say anything to me about how I am personally ruining their lives or destroying their QOL. Most of them are far too smart to say something ridiculous like that. Usually the experience ends in thanks and handshakes. I would be able to tell if I was jumpseating with someone like you that secretly hated me for the company I worked for, but they don't, and never have. Maybe I'll get the joy of jumpseating with you someday. Then I will finally get that experience you're so convinced I'm always having.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 508924)

The undercutting Mesa pride of turbofan and paxhauler are so easy to see from the outside...

I have no "Mesa pride".

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Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 508924)

I guess its kind of like Stockholm syndrome. You feel bad for JO and think he is your savior.

Show me one post where I've said I feel bad for J.O. or that he is my "savior". This is just a flat out lie you've made up in an attempt to prove your point. Use facts to back up your arguments, not lies and unsubstantiated accusations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 508924)

If you don't believe me guys, just ask some ex-Aloha pilots who YOU put out of work.

Already done that. Two of them actually. Both were working for other carriers and jumpseated on my flights. We talked at length about it. I apologized for everything Mesa management had done and for their loss. They made it very clear that they didn't hold me responsible and we talked during the flight like civilized professionals and parted ways on great terms. They never once blamed ME personally for putting them out of work, it's just you that is doing that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 509114)

Continental was able to find other regional pilots who would work for less at Colgan and CHQ and therefore I was furloughed from my second year at ExpressJet. I was on pace to make over $45k my second year. I wonder if Colgan FOs are able to do that, while flying 74 seats?

I mean this in all seriousness. I suggest you take a business class. It sounds like the foundation to your whole argument is the lack of your understanding of modern capitalism. There is always going to be someone willing to do the job for cheaper. That's how capitalism works buddy.

I gotta admit Turbo has valid points.:rolleyes:

Taken from another thread....

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboFan (Post 508458)

On the contrary, I've had many pilots ask for more information about where I went to school because their interested in passing it along to their kids, cousins, friends, etc. that want to become pilots as well. Uh, oh. Not more of us!!!! :eek:

You paid Mesa management for flight and RJ FTD training to get a lower paying job, and now you want to recommend that to others as a good way to join this profession. Good recommendation. Pay off one of the most criminal anti-labor management teams in our profession in order to get a job with Mesa at 250 hours. Nice. There is a difference between actually doing that, and recommending it. Your posts would be more believable if you were brand new at Mesa.... but after being there two years you still love it!

I can't think of a better example of Mesa pride. I wonder if a lot of the Aloha pilots out of work would recommend MAPD to their kids, cousins, friends, etc.

Things certainly look different from the ground up. I have seen both ends of the regional spectrum and can understand why you haven't seen the light.

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Originally Posted by TurboFan (Post 509610)

There is always going to be someone willing to do the job for cheaper. That's how capitalism works buddy.

One more thought. The people willing to do the job for less apply to work at the companies who pay less.

There is always someone willing to do the job for cheaper??? Really? So in other words, in order to compete, are you saying that United pilots are willing to do the job for less than American pilots? Ask some Delta pilots if they are willing to do the job for less than US Airways pilots? Run this question by an ExpressJet pilot: are you willing to fly a larger turboprop for less than Colgan? Not everyone is willing to underbid their fellow pilots for a job.

Ask some Aloha pilots if they would like their job back if they would do it for less than Mesa pilots. Employees that are not willing to work for less do not work for Mesa.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboFan (Post 509610)

I can't believe that you can honestly think Mesa is the reason other pilots are being furloughed. You obvious distain for Mesa is seriously clouding your ability to see the big picture. I work harder and for less money than any other regional pilot? Do I have to copy and paste some of the payscales from this very web site to prove you wrong? Mesa pilots are not the highest paid in the industry, that's for sure, but we're far from the lowest. No question our CBA sucks and our QOL sucks because of it, but we're actively trying to change that right now. Don't get me wrong, I am not a Mesa fanboy by any means and don't agree with most of our managements decisions. I hope my time at Mesa is short lived, and in that time I hope to do my part via the union to improve QOL at Mesa and to take an active role in doing so.

What YOU are thinking maybe. Dude, I'm no spring chicken to this industry. I have many, many friends outside of Mesa and have done my share of jumpseating. I've yet to have someone say anything to me about how I am personally ruining their lives or destroying their QOL. Most of them are far too smart to say something ridiculous like that. Usually the experience ends in thanks and handshakes. I would be able to tell if I was jumpseating with someone like you that secretly hated me for the company I worked for, but they don't, and never have. Maybe I'll get the joy of jumpseating with you someday. Then I will finally get that experience you're so convinced I'm always having.

I have no "Mesa pride".

Show me one post where I've said I feel bad for J.O. or that he is my "savior". This is just a flat out lie you've made up in an attempt to prove your point. Use facts to back up your arguments, not lies and unsubstantiated accusations.

Already done that. Two of them actually. Both were working for other carriers and jumpseated on my flights. We talked at length about it. I apologized for everything Mesa management had done and for their loss. They made it very clear that they didn't hold me responsible and we talked during the flight like civilized professionals and parted ways on great terms. They never once blamed ME personally for putting them out of work, it's just you that is doing that.

I mean this in all seriousness. I suggest you take a business class. It sounds like the foundation to your whole argument is the lack of your understanding of modern capitalism. There is always going to be someone willing to do the job for cheaper. That's how capitalism works buddy.

You're right, Mesa pilots aren't to blame. We'll wait to see what happens with this TA, then all bets are off. There are no guns pointed at your heads this time. Now is the time to prove all us wrong.

First off, this will be my last post on this subject. I think I have made my argument quite well. It's obvious you're just resorting to lies and slander in a vain attempt to prove your point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 509733)

You paid Mesa management for flight and RJ FTD training to get a lower paying job, and now you want to recommend that to others as a good way to join this profession. Good recommendation.

If you actually read the thread that you quoted me from, which for anyone that would like to fact check this themselves is the http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/re...e-1st-job.html thread, you would have seen the following direct quote from me:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboFan (Post 508481)

Let me make two things perfectly clear:
1. I would NOT recommend MAPD right now due to the state of the airline industry and the apparent declining quality of the school.

So your entire post was misleading and flat out wrong. Your lying, plain and simple. You seem to put a lot of words in my mouth by saying things like:

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwa757 (Post 509733)

but after being there two years you still love it!

I've never said I've "love[d]" any part of working for Mesa, again, putting words in my mouth which you seem to do in every post.

For the sake of others who want this thread back I'm done with the argument, I think we've both made our points quite clear.

You can have the last word, just try to make it fact based as opposed to speaking for me and making crazy accusations which aren't true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purpleanga (Post 509744)

I highly doubt this contract will pass. Every Mesa pilot I know of claims to be voting no. I totally agree, this is the time to start making some changes and earn a fair contract. If we do go into bankruptcy J.O. needs a contract to help make an argument to the creditors. I'm certainly not going to give him one unless it fixes a lot more of the problems than this TA proposes.