A pilot will never be able to walk into a company with a resume and get hired without having to stand in line with a bunch of others whose numbers outweigh the positions.

There will always be someone else standing there to compete with. This is the goal of managements - it keeps costs down. Too many people are trying to avoid having to do real work and flight training schools make millions from selling a phony dream to these types.

The "status" of the profession is dropping to a point where more people can achieve the end game.

Something big needs to come into the mix to make it tougher to achieve that first rung on the ladder. High times, type of experience, more formal education, you name it.

A guy can go from zero to right seat on an RJ in less than a year assuming the training is financed. Kickbacks from the schools to the airlines for their so called "guaranteed interview" just grease up the chute. The ROI on the newbie is higher, he's still full of the dream and will work under any conditions to pay off the huge debt he's stuck with.

Its the perfect scenario for an airline bean counter.

Something needs to end this in time for the next hiring boom or many of us will never have chance at a fruitful career.

No No NO you have it all wrong... Instead of single-pilot part 25 they'll just transition to a UAV fleet with two of those blow up figures from the men in black movies as the cockpit dummies:rolleyes:

At Comair, I would pretty much call the furloughs "massive". From October 2008 to January 2009 there were 297 furloughed. This month many are going to be gone that took a voluntary furlough and more involuntary furloughs (already announced) will be gone in November. So, in October 2008 there were almost 1400 pilots (not sure on the exact number) and in January 2010 there will be around 1000. Pretty much saying that in one year (October 2008-November 2009) a third of the pilots will be gone, either voluntary or involuntary.

If you see two captains flying, it's most likely that the one on the right was downgraded. It's not that they are short FO's.

Also, I always find it humorous when I fly on Delta and the crew says "I had no idea that Comair furloughed anyone." Even though Delta is directly to blame for the furloughs.

Well you are not alone Expressjet has already furloughed 347 and that is after early outs, colas, and 40 hour lines. With more to maybe come, who knows.

Maybe the fact that regionals aren't growing is a good thing long term. Sure it sucks right now but in the end it is probably for the best. Fee per departure flying is dead in my opinion. Until the regionals start taking on the burden of paying for their own fuel I don't expect to see any huge growth in the regional sector. I don't think any regional would be profitable if they had to cover the fuel and all the other expenses when the poo started hitting the fan. (Hotels for cancellations/meals for stranded passengers/etc...)

Mesa early 07' 1850 ish
Mesa Now 1260 ish

Funny, AirWillie, but I think you are on to something. It's not that we should have low expectations, but that we should have realistic expectations.

When I was a T-34 flight instructor, one of my first students was a Naval Academy graduate who was at the top of his class and literally a rocket scientist. During the Fam 0 where I show him a preflight and brief him on the flight training program, I asked him his plans. His response surprised me, "I'm going to fly jets, then I'm going to Test Pilot School, then I'm going into the Astronaut program". He said it like some reservations clerk had already booked his itinerary and he had the tickets in his pocket. As it turned out, his superior brain power didn't translate as easily into good old eye-hand coordination and flight sense. He got his wings, but he didn't fly jets.

For us, the lesson is to have a full understanding of both the path Corporate America is headed, the globalization of the economy and the full impact of the Airline Deregulation Act of 1978 (which is still affecting all of us).

In short, the legacies are shrinking. Airlines are consolidating to the point where, instead of growing, they are forming alliances to reduce competition. The proposed AA-BA alliance comes to mind. Meanwhile, the former regionals are growing into the vacuum created by the retreating legacies. The net result will be more regional pilots competing for fewer mainline jobs. Many will see their dream of becoming a major airline pilot come to fruition, but most will not.

It's good to have dreams and ambition, but we need to temper those dreams and ambition with a clear and realistic view of the situation. Many of those who are either bitter about being "stuck in the right seat at a regional" or, worse, bitter Captains are people who, IMHO, never had a realistic appraisal of their options and opportunities. Even if they did get to a mainline, they'd probably be bitter about not moving up faster. The problem is within them, not what is happening outside of them. FWIW.

And that surprises you?:cool:

I wish my company would "downsize" some of the outsourced express flying. Maybe that would keep more of us on the mainline property. That's what most of us got into the pax-hauling airline business for in the first place, right? We didn't plan to make a career out of regional flying. Regionals have become career airlines, but at the expense of mainline.
I've been furloughed once, and I am about to be furloughed again. I understand the stress, the anxiety and the pain associated with losing one's job. This is no slight against the furloughed Comair pilots.
But are you truly surprise that a Delta crew has no idea what's going on at Comair? They've got their own issues to worry about. Not the least of which is how much possible downsizing may occur at Delta due to the merger, or the expansion of express flying.
Let's put the shoe on the other foot. Let's assume Delta starts a significant reduction of mainline domestic capacity, while at the same time expanding the express side of the equation. While Comair pilots enjoy better schedules, early upgrades, the return of all furloughees and maybe even hiring, how much sympathy or concern will the Comair pilots sincerely have for the furloughed Delta pilots?

The "I got mine" attitude is disappointing, but hardly surprising.

Hog

How many of those 590 pilots are out on furlough?? Certainly not all. The rest left to other carriers back in the regional hiring boom of Summer 07.

Probably not the best comparision to the Comair situation.

getting close to 200 i think
Mesa has lost 590 ish pilot positions is the point.
just because people left on there own doesnt change the fact that we would have close to 600 people on F had they not left