In some cases, doing a full approach is more efficient than being vectored onto an approach. It depends on the situation. Also, starting a non-precision approach can be just enough to get you below a cloud base, sometimes, which can be useful for getting a contact approach, without being vectored around onto a precision approach. I guess you guys just don't operate that way, and will take the vectors in almost all cases. I'm not bashing you for this. It's just the way you guys operate. News to me.

 

You laugh at the single pilot freight dogs eh? Well, anything that gets the person flying, in the weather, and making decisions will help. Sitting in the right seat of a C-152 does not help that but it does prepare you to move on the the next step. Most pilots over the last 7 years have skipped the freight, canyon, and Alaska flying that we all used to do. Good thing the majors have not been hiring. This stagnation will help those with less experience get a few hard winters under their belt. You helped prove my point in your post. Acting as the PIC, flying in the weather, honed your instrument and decision making skills. Good for you. I know I'll be safer non-reving in the back of your plane.

 

The following was in a letter of agreement at NWA from 1989 through the last contract:

6. Departure without at least one (1) functioning autopilot shall be at the captain’s discretion. Every effort will be made to effect repairs at the first maintenance base.

From what I read in the original post, it sounds like the Captain made a good decision. This is not a contest to see how great a pilot you are because you've flown without an autopilot before - this is about safety. Apparently the pilots at Northwest thought it important enough to include it in their contract for years.

 

Thank you. You said it much better than i could. And for the record. I am not just a "box Hauler". I have lots of 121 experience Flying the 74 Classic to every corner of the earth. And several thousand hours of airbus 320 time. If i didnt feel comfortable hand flying any of these machines at altitude. In the event the "magic" fails in cruise flight. I would tear up my ticket and quit flying. However in this Captains case. If he's dealing with several dmi's, weather suks, non precision app, un familar aerodrome, and fatigue, and so on......... Kudos for pulling the plug if you feel over your head. First rounds on me.

Peace out.

Leardriver

 

I agree. Most people didn't have to do that before they got into the industry. What I am laughing at is the people who think that their freight dog days transfer over to airline flying. You know what my freight was. Checks. Lots and lots of checks. And like I said in my previous post I learned more about decision making during that time than I did flying IFR. After flying IFR for so long the skill of actually flying isn't the problem. It is the decision making that is the problem. I could back in the day take a Navajo and fly a single engine ils down to mins in bad weather and wouldn't think much of it. Thats not the point. The point is I shouldn't have taken that Navajo in the first place because the engine had already had to be shut down several times in the last week. And by taking that plane and losing that engine I have greatly narrowed my available alternatives to make sure there is a safe outcome. The times where my gut told me something was wrong, or to not do something, and I did it anyway were the times I realized that the checks werent worth my life and that what I had done nearly cost me everything.

Now my cargo is far more valuable than a bunch of checks. My cargo is moms, dads, brothers, sisters, my wife and kids etc etc. Anytime now that I feel something is not right I dont do it. I used up all my luck flying checks around. Now sound judgement and not taking unecassary risks is my motto. I know my limits. I know when I am biting off more than I can chew and I just dont do it. My passengers may hate me for it as they are giving me dirty looks while we deplane. That is fine. That is what I am asked to do. Be responsible and take charge. My kids dad is on the plane and they expect him to come home safely every time and that is what I intend on doing.

Here is a little story to illustrate my point:

The owner of a trucking company is looking to hire a driver to carry cargo up and down a mountain. The road is narrow and along a cliff. Three guys showed up for the interview and the owner explained to them the conditions and that great skill would be needed to drive the trucks up the narrow mountain passes. The first guy said, "I can drive the car within 6 inches of the ledge, thats how good I am". The next guy said, "Well I can drive the truck within 4 inches of the ledge, thats how good a driver I am." The last guy got the job when he said, "I will stay as far away from the ledge as I can."

 

I think the issue is some of us have scared the crap out of ourselves using the "just go try it" method. Once you've had several of those," you know I probably should have sat this one out" sort of moments you start to be able to recognize things starting to come together. I guess that's why they always say there's old pilots and there's bold pilots but no old bold pilots.

In 121 you just almost never cancel a flight, I'm sure this captain knew that but was seeing the pieces start to fall into place and said, "No Thanks"

 

Will a suspension show up on a PRIA?

 

If all your using is "previous experiences" to made a decision to not attempt a flight then it's time to think about changing to a more predictable job.

 

If you're talking just the suspension, doubt it since PRIA is about training ONLY, not being disciplined or what goes in your personal file at your emloyer.

Now, if for some reason it's determined by the braintrust of flight ops management that the CA has to go to some kind of training for his actions and he bonks it, well, MAYBE that might show up. But I doubt it, and has NOTHING to do with the suspension in the first place. All that is is a hypothetical scenario.

I think the ONLY place where the CA will have to deal with it is if he interviews and the app and/or interviewer asks if the pilot has ever been "disciplined". And just going on what's been provided, it'd probably be a slam dunk on his part as long as he answered the question with the objective facts, states why he did it, and leaves emotion and opinion of PCL management out of it.

 

That was before RVSM right? If this guy blasted off he would have to stay pretty low under RVSM airspace, right in the weather.

I agree though. He should have just waited it out till the weather cleared.