MikeB525

Hey guys,

Very tired right now, but I'll try and write it while it's fresh in my mind. It's sort of long.

My father is a sales executuve (nothing that high, but very good money) for an air logistics company. Today they had a mega shipment from their biggest account that needed to be sorted, segregated, restacked, and labeled. Since my hours have been severely cut at my regular retail job, I jumped at the chance to make some money. I spent 12 hours in a warewhouse doing all that. I don't think I've ever sweat that much, and by the peak of the day I was starting to smell like rotten eggs (seriously, no joke). My dad was able to pull off a wage of $13/hr for me, so I made $150 for the day. Today was a longer day, but if I were to do that job full time for like for 8 to 10 hours a day, I'd make around $25K or so a year.

This is around the same as a first year regional FO.

The warehouse is in Elizabeth, NJ, and all day the planes going off EWR 22R were screaming right past the building. I would see their gear doors close as they past.

Although it would be a while before I'm qualified (I have 140 hours and just got signed off to do the IFR checkride) and I will definently have another job for at least a couple years after college, I'm still seriously thinking about making the push and becoming an airline pilot, at least for a few years.

Now back the the salary. After realizing this, what feeling did I come away with? Did I start to feel cheated by aviation? The answer, surprizingly, is: no, not really.

I though "If I was only making $25K, I'd much rather do it by flying a regional jet than by doing this warehouse work". Stacking pallets of cargo while covered in sweat and smelling like rotten eggs isn't exactly enjoyable or glamorous. The guys I was working with were really great, and seemed very impressed when they found out about my flying. When I told them the comparable new-hire salary, they were surprised, but still thought the same thing: they would rather do the pilot job.

I didn't specifically inquire, but I believe after a year of working at the warehouse your salary probably wouldn't go up much, whereas you'd get a substantial raise at the better regionals. Also, when I get my BS in meteorology, my starting salary would probably only be about $35K, even in NJ.

So yea, those are my thoughts and feelings. For the same money, I'd rather be an airline pilot than a warehouse worker. It may be the same money at first, yes, but the major point is the job itself. I remember there was once a thread here were a guy said he could give up aviation to go work in a warehouse driving a forklift for the same amount of money. Although I didn't work the forklift, I did work the warehouse floor. Trust me, YOU DON'T WANT TO! Once again, these are just the feelings I came away with.

Ok, you can call me an idiot now.

VegasBoy

I would rather work the warehouse than subsidize a regional carrier that is making money hand over fist.
I completely relate to your position. We all felt that way at some point and that is why airline pilots make **** money now.
Now, I wouldn't work for a pathetic wage; I'd rather be unemployed; however, at one point we all thought getting 25k (or 12k flying a 120 out of EWR for COEX) was the greatest thing ever, because we didn't have to work in a warehouse.......wrong. It won't make sense until you are 15 years into your career.

Go to school. Get an MBA or a JD, get a real job and fly when you want.

This comes from a 15 year pilot flying international in a heavy and on my layovers I'm studying for lawschool. I like my job but this career is going to ****.

cjdriver

I've both been a professional pilot flying great airplanes to cool destinations, and worked in a non-aviation related field making a lot of money. I own my own twin and use it for business and personal flying. I recommend doing both if you can. Right now I'm back to making money so I can get some expensive work done on my airplane without depleting my assets. But then I hope to go back to flying again if I can find the right job. I will tell you it's a must for me to be able to call BS when I see it in a flying job and go do something else. I have a hard time taking it up the rear, so I have to have options. I know others that can take it, and my hat's off to them. Keep your options open, be your own man, not "the man's" man.

cyrcadian

Oy.

That's the sad part, it is the same money. Don't "settle" for that illusterous airline career. Trust me, work at an airline for a year, when it comes down to it, it's just a job.

You're not an idiot, just uninformed.

ryane946

It's got a LONG way to go before it gets to $hit. Think if you start off at age 22.
Age 22-26, $20-30k as flight instructor/regional FO
Age 27-30, $50-70k as a regional capt
Age 30-40, Major FO $70-$120k
Age 40-60, Major capt $100k - $200k

Hmmm. Sounds like a pretty good career salary amount. How about toughness of the job. Well most airline jobs are 4 on, 3 off. Sounds good to me. 80 hours a month. As long as you don't commute!! Ya, I know you spend a lot more time "working" than flying, but you are still talking 30hrs a week. I don't consider time spend on a layover eating in a resteraunt or sleeping in a hotel working. If you love to travel (like me), it should be fun. But, when your family becomes important, just stay in your fleet/seat, get very senior (give up some money), and bid a real good schedule. Personally, I would rather be off for 72-96 hours to take care of my kids, rather than being home overnight.

To me, $hit is relative. If you are currently working in a warehouse, then get into flying. If you currently have a good job, that you enjoy, pays lots of money, and you get lots of time off (like flying), then stay there. It will probably be more stable. Just because flying jobs are not dynamite like they used to be, they are still pretty damn good. Get out of the regional world as soon as you can, and you are set. And DO NOT commute!!

STILL GROUNDED

Part of the issue is that you had not spent the better part of your younger life and a whole boat load of money on becoming a warehouse worker. You also as a warehouse worker do not take the lives of 50 people 6 times a day into your hands cause when things go balls up and they do your the one who could loose it all. Also working the warehouse puts you home every day, lets you drink a beer after work without being a felon and gives you a general quality of life.

In contrast I feel exactly the same way you do! I love my job and it is just a job but I have slung 14' drywall sheets and poured 3 trucks of concrete and sold real estate to people who self destruct and really had a lot of crap jobs that go know where.

We all are flying on the future, the future hopefully being good pay, good benefits and the reasonable ability to make a living doing something we enjoy. I could make a lot more money being at home, but I've had it and money isn't everything. Make your own decision for your own reasons. Take what everyone here has to say with a grain of salt. Some are bitter and washed up, every job is the same but this is all they have ever done so they don't realize it. After awhile they all suck. That's why they call it work.

MikeB525

Additional notes and clarifications.

I'm not actually working in the warehouse. It was a one-day thing that they needed help with; maybe with some stuff here and there in the future. I'm a full time college student. My normal job is working in a retail store and learning to DJ for an entertainment company. DJing is fairly cool but the retail job is starting to get irritating.

That job yesterday beat me up hardcore. I slept til close to noon today and my fingers hurt like hell when I bend them.

As for QOL, my father, even tho he's a "white collar" sales exec, would often times come out and help out on the dock, partly because he wants to make sure the freight gets properly managed, because if the customer isn't happy it's his @$$ and his commission. He would do it with some frequency when me and my sister were yonger, and when he got home he would only have the energy to sit in front of the TV. As for when he was home , it would have to do with when the cargo needed to be handled. For example, yesterday we left the house around 11am, and got back after midnight. If I was a father with small kids, they would have been in school when I left and asleep when I got home. I remember that very clearly from my childhood. My father was "home every night" but I would sometimes go a day or 2 without seeeing him.

I'm not in a hurry to fly and I know I'll have some sort of "normal" job after college. I'm still on the fence about airline flying, and even if I had no airline aspirations, I would still be flight training. No matter where life takes me I want to hold at least comm/CFI, mainly for Civil Air Patrol.

surreal1221

Gentlemen. . . we must all consider our training, in whatever field, as an investment. Some investments cost more. Some don't. It's making a return on that investment that matters. Yes, it takes time. If you're willing to take the time and money (investment), be patient, and not buy a right seat on Gulfstream Airlines. . . you've got my support.

Just as I would expect everyone else to support me in my own endevours through this minefield (flight training).

johndt

It's very close to not being worth it for me. What's worth being away from your family, friends, and home for half your life. Remeber that you aren't gone 1 or 2 days. If you have a good line at a good airline (not great but good) you're probably getting 15 days off. That means that you're in a different city for half of your marriage, half of your kid's life, half of -your- life.

At what dollar value does that start to be attractive to you? Think hard about that.

flynavyj

depends on the person john, to some, family and kids aren't a high priority (maybe they don't want to have a wife and family) to others (the majority) it will probably be a tough pull. Can remember the professors saying "eventually, this flying thing will get old, and you're going to want the office job that pays you and you get normal hours...that's what we want to train you to get"

Whether or not most of us will take that jump from being a pilot to a check-airman on the sim, i dunno. If you still love what you do, but are torn between doing that and something else, you really do need to consider your options.