Not calling you a lier Bro, just saying that I am living proof that it is not accurate.

Not sure when HR told you this, maybe they had a shift in policy, or whoever told you was misinformed.

Dude I could care less about eagle hiring policy, that's just what they said recently. People are going to apply anyways so it doesn't matter.

I don't know how to feel after reading this. I've been literally sick over this because I have 4 busts. I made a stupid mistake on my commercial oral, and I royally screwed up on my CFII intial ride. Some of it was just an examiner that had some issues, but I'll be the first to admit I learned alot from the whole event. I'm to the point where I don't want to go and retake any CFI rides for fear of failing again.

Ultimately you can spot a 141 "failure" in someone's logbook. The schools would have to get REALLY devious about trying to cover those up...basically no logbook entries for "incomplete" checkrides.

Also if the FAA makes 141 failures reportable, they would be documented just like 61 failures and the DPE's would be putting THEIR ticket on the line if they covered it up.

141 operations have done the mock-stage-check-converted-to-real-stage-check deal before but that was allowed because 141 is kind of fuzzy on when you do the 8710...it could be done after-the-fact.

If the FAA changes the rules then an 8710 will be required BEFORE any event which could result in a certificate being issued...you would have to clearly violate the protocol to get around issuing a pink slip.

I think 141 needs to be on the same program as 61 as far as this goes. There is no valid reason why they should be any different (other than it's a good marketing gimmick).

Not if the student didn't pass the oral.

DPEs do not administer stage checks. A school examiner who happens to be a DPE can administer a stage check.


141 stage checks are NOT the same as check rides. A failed 141 stage check is NOT a failed check ride.

Sorry to bust on you Rick.

I was a 141 CP/examiner. I used the term loosely since a 141 examiner is equivalent to a DPE in that he can issue a certificate. Doesn't really matter what you call it.

Doesn't matter what you call the stage checks either...if they are not an EOC they don't count any more than any other training flight. If they are an EOC check then they are a checkride and should be treated the same as 61 as far as record-keeping goes.

But you are correct that a failed 141 oral is not going to be visible in someone's logbook. But if they should change the regs so that any failure of an oral of flight check will result in a pink slip...there is no good reason to allow 141 students an ability to hide their history to a greater extent than a 61 student..

Tim Martins was born with all his licenses and rating plus 5,000 turbine PIC

What is an EOC flight?

I think it stands for "End of Course"