ASA Pilot boots muslim passengers
 

I'd like to hear the Captains side of the story...

CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Two Muslim leaders who were removed from a commercial airliner in Memphis said they were told it was because the pilot refused to fly with them aboard.

Imams Masudur Rahman and Mohamed Azaghloul arrived at Charlotte-Douglas International Airport several hours after they were scheduled to arrive. They were forced off a plane by a pilot on Friday morning.

"It reminded me when the black lady was kicked from the bus because of racism. That history I found today in that plane," said Raham.

Both men passed multiple security clearances by TSA and Delta Airlines before boarding. They were even rescreened after they were pulled off the flight. Rahman said they had no problem being screened multiple times.

"It is their job to do it. It is out job to show our stuff. We don't have anything. We are living in America; we want the security of America," said Rahman.

But still the pilot refused to let them board.

"The only reason the pilot has cited was some of the passengers didn't feel comfortable, but when the passengers were asked if they felt uncomfortable, none of them indicated that they were," said the imams' attorney, Mo Idibili.

The imams said despite urging from Delta officials, the pilot didn't budge. They said Delta management apologized profusely and put them on a later flight. The flight the imams were kicked off of was operated by Atlantic Southeast Airlines, which is based in Atlanta. It does business with Delta but is not part of Delta.

Ironically, the two made the trip to Charlotte for a conference of imams, where they would be discussing "Islamophobia," the fear of Islam.

"Don't convict them in your mind and heart because you may be uncomfortable with someone who may have a different faith," said Jibril Hough with the Islamic Center of Charlotte.

Their attorney said his office plans to launch an investigation into the incident. If it turns out the pilot was not justified in putting the imams off the plane, his office will sue for negligence and a violation of civil rights. Atlantic Southeast Airlines released a statement and said it apologizes for any inconvenience but it takes security very seriously.

I don't think we have the whole story yet but if what is being said in the media is true. Then got some splaning to do and possibly open them self up for a HUGE Lawsuit

Sometimes I wonder if we've become the land of the free and the home where most of us are brave ...

Last week leaving BDL in the hotel van, an AA Capt told me he removed some Middle East terorist looking guys from his aircraft five years ago. The ACLU took it all the way to the Supreme Court. The Judge ruled that the FAR's state that since the Capt is soley responsible for the safe operation, case closed.

After having Hasidic Jews wearing Tefillin result in a diversion and declared emergency, I must agree with you.

Story on ajc.com said the plane pushed back then returned to the gate.

Of course you'd want to hear the captain's side of the story, but if ASA's media policy is like, well, everyone's else's, you won't hear a thing unless he gets deposed.

If it was a gate return, you'd think it would be based on something the FA saw.

That's a good point. It may have been the FA that had a problem with the men, not the CA. If that's the case, it puts the CA in a really tough position.

MOD Note: Folks, please be careful about discussing security procedures here.

If the Capt. really removed them because the other passengers were uncomfortable, he should have removed the "other" passengers. Booting these gents is simply redneck racism at its worst.

I really don't think racism is part of the problem. Im not saying there aren't racists out there, but after 9/11 99.9% of the American flying public get uncomfortable if they are on a flight with "muslims". There's lots of people that don't think they have a racist bone in their body, but when they see a person sitting 2 seats away that could be perceived as a "muslim" their mind starts thinking. Most people won't say anything, but it does happen.
I'm not saying what the captain did was right. Personally, I would have let them fly, but if you want to call him a racist then you also have to call 99.9% of the flying public racists also. If you would have removed the passengers who were a uncomfortable then the two muslims would have been the only one on the flight. Thats just how people think now, and it will take a long time for people think otherwise. Its just like how people are scared to fly in the first place. You can give them all the facts and tell them you're more likely to die on the way to the airport than on the flight itself, but most people still get nervous while the airplane is throttling up for take-off. The facts and statistics are there, but it doesnt change the way they think.
Let's face it... 9/11 effected more than just the twin towers.

I just dont see how this turns out good for ASA unless these guys made some threatening comments or something of that nature.

I find the racism allegations against the crew rather comical.

I know of NO crewmember who enjoys filling out reports or having conferences with management enough to arbitrarily remove a passenger without cause.

The path of least resistance is to just go fly, and there must be a darn good reason why these people were removed.

I agree with lostinpa. Hopefully we'll eventually hear the full details. The pilots had to know nothing good would come of this so I don't see how anyone would boot someone for no reason.

ajc.com story has a new wrinkle:

Transportation Security Administration spokesman Jon Allen in Atlanta confirmed the incident and said it was not initiated by that agency.

Another passenger aboard the flight called the AJC Saturday and said the pilot told him a different story.

Sean McKinney, an accountant from Greeenville, S.C., said he spoke to the pilot after landing in Charlotte and the pilot told him that TSA requested the plane return to the terminal.

"That seems more reasonable to me," said McKinney, 38, who was traveling for business. "Why would the pilot pull away from the gate if he had a concern with the passengers?"

Atlantic Southeast Airlines, which operates the flight, could not be reached for comment Saturday. Spokesman Jarek Beem said Friday evening the incident is under investigation.

McKinney said the Muslim men were screened by TSA along with other travelers before boarding the 8:40 a.m. flight.

"I had no problem with them. They seemed very cordial and professional," said McKinney, who said he overheard the men speaking in English while waiting to board.

McKinney said the men "stood out" but he noticed no passenger concern until after the plane returned to the terminal and TSA began searching the overhead luggage bins near where the men sat.

McKinney said the aircraft pulled away from the gate but the pilot announced they were turning around before reaching the runway.

TSA workers boarded the plane, removed Rahman and Zaghloul and began searching the overhead bins and the area near their seats, said McKinney, who landed in Charlotte two hours late.

Beem said the Muslim men were put on another flight to Charlotte later that day. "We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience that this may have caused," Beem said.

I agree - I can't imagine any captain I've flown with returning to the gate without an FA expressing concern over a situation in the back. Once we begin our engine start and taxi flows, the pax are no longer a major concern. If the captain is sticking up for the FA in this case, kudos to him for backing his crew! I'd love to hear the real story on this one!

Sometimes the difference between a good outcome and a bad outcome (life and death) is a split second decision that we, unless we are sitting in the seat making that decision, really don't know how we would decide. The Captain has authority over the safety of the flight, and as such, must make difficult decisions sometimes. Since every situation is different, I think we should be applauding the fact that he had the guts to make the decision he did. Too many of us are unwilling to make, and stand by, the tough decisions in life.

So were the 9/11 hijackers right up until H-Hour.

Not saying I agree without knowing any details, just arguing both sides of the coin. As was already mentioned, 9/11 had more effect than some realized. Radical Muslims failed to realize that in a free country with free speech, we'd still be free to exercise those privileges afterward, misplaced or not.

Please correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not completely up on my history), but if I recall correctly Rosa Parks and her fellow activists weren't inclined to strap on TNT and walk into a crowded cafe or bus, or fly airliners into a buildings.

Now, I'd actually be $2 that the two gentlemen in question aren't inclined do to so either. The problem being that there is precious little for the rest of the world to help us distinguish those Muslims who do advocate such acts from those who do not. The silence from within their community is deafening. As has been pointed out, the 9-11 hijackers were just ordinary people until that faithful day.

I'm not condoning or condemning the actions of the crew, but until the "vast majority of peaceful Muslims" stands up and denounces the other element and cleans their own house, then the problem is on their own heads.

Just my $ 0.02...

Hopefully I haven't stepped outside of the TOS...

I'm not going to call the pilot racist because I haven't heard his side of the story .. but I will definitely call it ignorant.

I couldn't agree with you more. It's a subject that a lot of people won't live up to but it exists. Again, I'm not say that the captain was right or wrong but I think you're observation is spot on!

How can it be racist when race is not even involved?
Last time I checked, being muslim isn't a race.

Id say rednecks are pretty scarce in New York, but when there is a "Muslim" on the plane...try telling a New Yorker there is nothing to worry about.

Why do you think they were attending a conference about the fear of Islam? Because after 9/11 that's just how people are

Same could be said for putting bombs on cargo planes with a crew of two. By definition terrorism defies logic.

I'll wait til we get more info before I give him a 'standing o'. There isn't enough info to say if this is a smart call or a stupid call or even his call at all yet. The media so far has painted this in a pretty biased light. I imagine/hope there is more to the story.

I am a New Yorker and when I see a muslim on a plane I never think "OH GOD IT'S A TERRORIST" that is too ignorant, thank god New Yorkers aren't like that, we live in a city that has a lot of diversity. Is everyone in Tennessee KKK ?

post best post on this thread. well said

I second that emotion .
The media does have a bad habit of jumping the gun on stories like this and we schould have learned this from past media stories involving situations like this but apparently not .



Fred

Yep. If you think the Imams got a rough ride, you ought to see what we do to Yankees!

Some of the posts here are way off base. You people would seriously risk letting a potential terrorist on your plane in order to avoid being labeled a 'racist'?!

It's ignorant of YOU to assume that the sole reason these people were kicked off is because they were muslim. I'd wager that in the course of this captain's career he's carried more than one muslim in the past, therefore there was clearly something that set the people in question apart which we are not privy to.

Kudos to the ASA crew. I'll be damned if I ever push back from the gate with a doubt in my mind as to whether or not someone on my airplane is a terrorist, regardless of the reason. If they want to be offended they can do it while being questioned by some TSA goon. If you want to call me a racist for that then feel free, it doesn't hurt my feelings. I may have some choice words for you as well though.

As an aside, a non-reving employee at our company recently refused to get on an airplane due to the presence of some suspicious looking individuals of middle eastern origin. She alerted the authorities, the individuals were pulled from the airplane. Without going into detail suffice it to say these individuals were found by the government to be persona non grata. Didn't see that story in the news though did you? People like this ARE still out there folks, and they want to kill YOU and YOUR families. Taking the necessary precautions is NOT negligent as this ridiculous lawsuit alleges.

No, and I'm sure you have plenty of friends who don't have your skin color as well which proves how diverse you are. Your stereotyping of others shows how ignorant you are. New Yorkers are as clean as the wind-driven snow, right?

New York Police Arrest Black Man After He's Assaulted by 8 White Men

Mexican Immigrant Victim of NY Hate Crime

NY Boy, 12, Accused Of Hate Crime Attack On Muslim Classmate

NY State Sees 14% Surge in Hate Crime

Your going off on a tangent, as I said I want to hear the captains side, but just reading the article it seemed very ignorant at first. I just can't hear that 99,9% of the public was scared of muslims after 9/11 that is outrageous.

Nowhere have I seen where the pax were ejected for simply being Muslim.

Counterpoint. Racism is not limited to white folk. In New York, no less

YouTube - a 18-year old white man was beaten with a concrete brick by 10 black men for dating a black girl

Maybe your selective choice of links indicates a kernel of racism in your own makeup, eh?

There are no tangents or geometry of any form involved here.

No, I don't believe it is limited to any particular race. But the examples I gave were to point out the hypocrisy of a NY trying to preach to those in TN (no, I'm not a resident, past or present).

It wasn't the number of passengers on board on 9/11 that created the biggest damage.

And the shoe bomber wasn't looking to hijack the plane, he was looking to blow it up. Part of their plan is to instill fear into the public and they don't need to hijack a 757 and fly it into something to accomplish this. All pilots need to be extra vigilant right now as our country is expecting a counter attack of some sort.

No, just a parroting of Juan Williams, Fox News' favorite reborn lib.