Roger is no longer in charge. Chip childs is the new chairman of the RAA.

 

When one ultimately only cares about themselves then that's what you get, one person against the others. The "others", even if they make the "rules", certainly don't care only about themselves, they work together to make sure individuals only think about themselves.

I've been in aviation 30+ years, did the regional thing in the 80's. I am furloughed and seem to be SOL right now, but I can't and won't go back to the regionals. Those in the regionals now don't know how much worse you have it. I fully understand the way it works, the narrow pipeline that may lead to the 50/50 chance (at best) that you'll make it to the majors or whatever passes as a good gig these days. The system is totally rigged against the majority of the pilots. Yes, I've been a active union member, but that's fallen down hard - essentially a fail situation. (which is why I think a lot of pilots take the "individual pass, they see how unions seem to little for the majority of the pilots, at least in the regional realm). What the union, or someone must do is get RLA amended. When essentially the government tells you when you can strike and also approves various ways for carriers to go bankrupt (and toss much of your agreement) that's the top tier of the rigged system. There's really a lot of other things that need to be done, but time and again it seems to come down to that, amending the RLA. One strike every ten years isn't going to do anything, in fact it can make it worse, witness the dismantling of Comair.

This argument over pay and conditions has been going on 10+ years now, and every year the chorus is it'll get better, and how much worse can it get? Yet after ten+ years, you have your answer.

I am not trying to trash anyone at all. I think most pilots do an outstanding job most times in spite of the conditions they are in.

 

I don't know chazbird,

Back then;

-2,500 TT and an ATP, to be even looked at for a job that you still had to pay 10 Grand to fly a Metro
-$12 an hour FO pay, 21$ an hour CA pay (J-32 TranStates, early 90’s not the 80’s but still) and no flight attendant.
-No internet forum for the gouge. The forum was an FE who used to instruct floating through the FBO and regaling the instructors with tales of the interview, ground school and life in the big leagues.
-Typed airline applications then snail mailed. Then wait and pray.

off the top of my head.

Each generation has their own challenges.

 

This is all easily summed up:

#1: The public does not care about how little we get paid. They only care about cheaper tickets. This will never change no matter how illogical it seems.

#2: Airlines (Regional Airlines in particular) will always dangle a carrot which plenty of pilots will promptly run after. The latest "everybody at Eagle is guaranteed a job at AA" is a perfect example.

#3: Airlines (Regionals in particular) will continue relying on people's passion for flying to staff their aircraft. Granted, less people are taking the financial plunge these days..but there will always be kids with "daddy's money" who will push forward with flight training ignoring the costs vs returns.

#4: Any future pilot shortage will be offset by larger aircraft being flown for lower wages after all the current batch of pilots begin retiring...

It will take an act of Congress (re-regulation) to change any of this. Short of that...don't expect this industry to change for the better...ever. The looming pilot shortage, as real as it is will do nothing to change pay or QOL. It will simply force Airlines to invent new ways to pay us nothing and work us longer.

 

Not true... I flew the metro in the 80's and never had to pay anyone $10,000.00 ! Also made much more than $12 an hour to fly it. Not really sure where this guy supposedly went for such a bad deal?

 

I interviewed w/ /CoEx in 1992, and as I recall it would've been based in EWR making 12K first year. I came home and told my wife there was no way, not with a family.

 

You realize the government intervenes in your negotiations and holds your pay rates lower right now, right? Government intervention in your favor would only be fair or they should butt out of the negotiations.

 

Most 3rd year regional first officers are making more than the average median income in America. I think don't think too many 23 years olds will be getting much sympathy because they are only making $40,000 on 3rd year pay. Especially considering that college isn't required. All it takes to get in the regional seat is a high school diploma and a few hundred hours of flight time. If you don't like it don't take the job but quite crying about it. Wait, I forgot they are they entitled generation.

 

$40k is still underpaid. I'm actually on 6th year rj fo pay...and it is still less than 40k, not by much but still less. I find it stupid how all the mainline pilots come on the regional threads and say things like "quit crying, leave of you don't like it". You're not the one having to do these jobs. If you big bad mainline pilots would stop giving away your scope, and flying till 65, we would not be having this conversation.

 

Median income in the US is $49,000 and falling. Most pilot bases are in higher cost cities. Most regional pilots have a 4 year degree + specialized training + travel away from home = should be making more than median income.

I am not overly romantic about 80's regional life, it was a stepping stone then, instead of climbing Mt. Everest now. I did, however, although I did make an inflation corrected (1987 to 2011) 42k as a first year FO on a SAAB, 15 on/off and it had a FO, although I am not sure what means. By the 90's it was well on its way to the bottom, the code shares and eventual buyouts of the mid 80's is what eventually sent it all down hill, although with expanded flying. There used to be many independent regionals with their own routes, some were horrible, some were really quite good. True, it did take 2500/500 and (sometimes) an ATP to get in, and you had to mail a resume/application, which I think is a better way - the internet has lead to a huge flood of resumes. A certain fractional I know has 14,000 pilot resumes on file, all internet. They are obviously overwhelmed and now they only hire through pilot referrals, ultimately not a good thing because like any organic system that is a way to inbreed and get a disease. In ancient days I'd research a company at the library, I think it kept 14,000 resumes from showing up.