PIC turboprop less marketable than PIC jet?
 

1: Do the legacies care weather you were a CA on a CRJ700, E170, or a SAAB?

2: If one has jet SIC time and gets a DEC Turboprop job, is that person going to be less marketable than the all Jet time with PIC applicant?

1) Yes, it is a known fact that Saab pilots are better drinkers and lovers.

2) See above.


(This topic has been beat to death before...you can probably search it)

The most recent thread is from 07. Furthermore they seem to progress into who's the better pilot and get stuck there. I'm not interested in anything but marketability at the legacies.

MARKETABILITY ONLY PLEASE!

Thanks!

So, we can charm the HR honeys and cheer the old Check Airmen.

1000hrs PIC Turbine...if you can check the box, that's all that matters.

The competition to get to the majors is extremely tough. People will argue that a certain plane means more in the logbook but the sad truth is that you aren't getting an interview at a major without networking your ass off or being related to the company. It is all about who you know and will be for a couple of years. PIC time is valuable to meet minimums but once you have the minimums you just stepped into the deep end of thousands of people just like you.

Turboprop time is definitely less valuable. I've seen it first hand.

Exactly

Check the box and join the line....

The thing is you cant get in line unless you can check the box. So the way i see it..if its turbine, its turbine. Period. Now you guys can argue about whose 'turbine is bigger' if you like. I'll just work on checking the box. Now back of Call of Duty.

On an apples to apples basis vs Jet PIC than yeah sure. Many people still value the differing skill set Turbine PIC brings to the table in relation to command skill/decision making and all the random fun experiences one usually gathers flying a turboprop for any length of time.

Granted in today's job market it's infinitely more difficult getting to a major without Jet PIC (minority/Equal Opportunity not included) but I think turboprop PIC can open other doors (intl airlines, 121 supplementals) that thousands of hrs RJ SIC won't.

Granted this is just my opinion....

And funnily enough the company I work at only counts 0.7 of every one of my PIC hours on the turboprop I flew for years towards Captain upgrades on the jet. Talk about cheapening it!

With only 2 posts I smell flamebait. Use the search function and youll see this topic has been argued ad nauseum.

You absolutely must fly the jet, the turboprop isnt considered a real plane, so the time is useless. Dont you know Turboprop pilots arent really pilots....:rolleyes:

All of my TPIC is turboprop. Friend of mine that started at fedex last year, had the same.

All depends on the requirements of the company you're looking to get on with. Turboprop experience doesn't mean too much if a company wants jet experience. Jet time will cover your basis a little better than turboprop. As for who is the better pilot? The autopilot on a turboprop takes MUCH more skill to manipulate than that of a jet!

(I know pilots who have gotten hired on at UPS and SWA with nothing but turboprop time.)

Didnt you mean the auto pilot on the TP takes much more skill to operate than the jet itself does....lol

Ok now I'm just stiring the pot...:D

Not at all flame bait, it's a legit question. Trust me, I have searched.

I specifically wanted this discussion to be focused on one thing. Forgive my curtness, but no egos, no who is the better pilot discussions, no discussions on whats more challenging to fly, I don't give care about that. All I care about is what HR and the board cares about. I care about marketability with United, American, Delta and the likes.

What is gonna get me there first? 1000TPIC in two years on a prop or 1000 TPIC on a jet in four years?

Thanks all

In my opinion it really matters what airline you are referring too . Most want the PIC no matter what's it is in . That being said JetBlue is very big on glass / FMS jet time. A few have slipped through with just turboprop pic time but it is about 2 percent of the pilot group. Than they also hire jet sic guys with zero PIC time. So go figure. Just like most places , it's a lot of who you know more than what you know.

:D Oh, but it's fun though, isn't it?

This will always be a Major airline battle of the bias'. They all go through a "We only want jet applicants" phase, then it dies out, 'then 1 guy ruins it, then starts all over again. When it comes to ability, by the time a 3000 TPIC turboprop guy and 3000 TPIC jet guy get interviewed by a major, they both have 1 thing in common.....they haven't crashed and died yet. I call that...even Steven. They both are good at certain things, and bad at others. Personally, I think the bias comes from people who haven't flown a t-prop. They should hire the person, not the equipment.

I think some legacies might care whether you say weather when you really meant whether...

Unless you have great connections, 1000 PIC - no matter what it is - will get you nowhere. If you do have connections - you've got a decent shot (at an interview) whether it's prop or jet.

Then again, what do I know. I've been in this industry for 13 years and I'm still stuck at a regional.

Maybe it was just you or your friend instead of the turboprop time.

Thanks a lot dude. You made me spit coffee out my nose I was laughing so hard. Jagoff:D

It honestly will just depend on what airline you want to fly for.

Check out their hiring requirements and see what they're looking for.

There's "Minimum requirements" and there's "Preferred requirements". Look at both if you want to be competitive.

But honestly if/when you get the interview it's not going to matter much what's on your resume. It's going to matter how you interact with everyone around you and if they can see themselves flying a 4-day trip with you.

My .02

I am going to say something here that is going to come across as very harsh, but read the whole thing. There is good advice here.
Quit worrying about what HR wants and worry about what will give you good quality of life, decent pay, and a sense of accomplishment regardless of what you fly. If you base your entire career path on a percieved roadmap you believe is approved by (enter legacy of choice here), you will learn the very hard lesson that by the time you meet that standard you set, the standards will have likely changed. Why is everyone so hung up on this,"I have to fly a jet for the majors" kick. When did aviation cease to be a job that you found THRU NETWORKING that offered good pay, a great QOL, and working with a good group of people regardless of what you fly. Why are people willing to sacrifice all those things in the attempt to get to a Legacy early. Instead of looking at it like you are, take a step back say to yourself I will find a job that I enjoy, have fun with and I like the people, doesnt matter what I am flying. Now sit back till you meet the mins and then apply. You WILL be a much more rounded happy pilot which will come out in your interview for the "Legacy", which may just equate to getting thte job. But then what do I know, Ive never flown a jet, I probably wasnt good enough:D

I don't think it matters as long as it meet their mins.

Airlines are hiring people, not pilots. They could care less whether you can fly or not anymore.

1000 PIC TT is becoming a relic of the past. Urban myth. More people leaving 9E lately are mid-time zero-PIC jet FO's. Captains with PIC time are either waiting for the magical call from Southwest, or are happy making $100k and can't take a pay cut.

Agreed. I believe there were a few fos hired at delta last time around. In this job market, that says something.

A lot of us have. You really need to take in one of the job fairs such as ERAU where you can speak with different hiring managers, only to have them tell you that without jet and glass time, your chances are slim. The 1000 TPIC box is being replaced by the 500 hrs jet time box, and similarly the mid-size to large jet type rating box. I did find one job that wanted a boat load of PT-6 time, fwiw.

All good points.

Bigger is better than smaller, jet is better than prop, glass is better than steam and FMS is better than point to point.

I would without a doubt take the closer turbine PIC in a prop over the jet PIC at a later date. One thing that is common is that 1000 TPIC is a requirement for most..id get that box checked as soon as possible. Once you have those hours you can start looking elsewhere for other options to enhance your resume.

As others have said the most important thing you can do to enhance your resume is network. No amount of experience will get you in the door faster than an uncle on the hiring board.

For what its worth..I was hired by jetBlue with no jet PIC. I only had turbo prop PIC and a handful of jet SIC hours. I did have glass and FMS if it was worth anything. I cant speak for a legacy carrier though as I did not apply to any.

All the best to you!

Or they WANT SIC only guys because they figure nobody else will when they start hiring, meaning they have a stable FO base that won't be jumping ship a year after arriving, costing them big training $$$s. (see Jetblue/Spirit.)

CAL did a lot of this in the mid 2000s. They were typing new hires in the 737 and they would bail to SWA. One of the solutions was zero pic folks because type or not they were not qualified for SWA.

Didn't have to be zero, ANYTHING less than 1000 will do.

True..I believe 1000 is a requirement there so you are right.

Beg to differ. While in training last year, DAL released 6 new hires last summer because they could not fly the DC-9 (as told by a very good friend of mine who happened to be a DC-9 instructor). All six had zero "steam gauge" time, just glass. They had no crosscheck and were let go.

Isn't that the norm these days? If one goes the regional route 99% of the people will be flying an all glass aircraft, except those that fly a Saab or Brasilia which still have ehsi and eadi. Be hard pressed to find a steam gauge regional at the majority of places. I can foresee a lot more troubles for people going to the 9.

there are thousands of us regional guys that got our IFR ratings in pre-1995 steam gauge mooneys, beeches, pipers etc then went on to fly 135 on steam gauges in turbines and twins. Not everyone here learned in a glass Diamond or Cirrus and went straight to an RJ....those scan skills will come back to this with experience.

I wasn't talking about the past, I was merely mentioning the new trend. More and more people will be going from G1000's and the like to RJ's with no significant steam time.

I wasn't trying to offend steam guys, I'm one!

Neither was I. Just saying, from what I've read and seen (jumpseating)...... the "new guys" have no crosscheck. They are used to looking at one instrument. They will face a very big hurtle if hired by DAL and going to the -9, -88, or 90, with nothing but glass time. The -88 and -90 will be around for along time, which will require a very good scan.

Good luck to those who get the chance. And that is meant in a very good way.