I think you are absolutely right. There is not an airline out there that wants seniority to carry over from one carrier to the next but it has nothing to do with performance metrics of company x vs company y. It has everything to do with money. I won't rehash the example I gave up top, but I believe that there are going to be a lot of Envoy pilots looking for an alternative airline in the near future. I think it is an absolute travesty that a pilot with 7,8,9 or more years of experience will be paid at a first year rate. It makes no sense.

More to your point if you are an airline doing the right things, your airline will not have a mass exodus of pilots and your airline will attract quality people. Additionally, if I as a pilot move from one company to another I have to attend and pass the company's FAA approved training syllabus. I cannot simply move from one company to another and start flying their airplanes. For every training event I attend I am essentially putting my certificate on the line. I think if you ask the majority of pilots, they would prefer to avoid extra jeopardy events if they can. In other words, most pilots will not move to another company on a whim.

It is my contention that every other industry pays for quality / experienced professionals. Could you imagine telling a surgeon with countless procedures performed on his resume that he / she has to start over because she moved to a different hospital. Ridiculous!
I don't know why this industry is any different. Maybe 3 decades ago it made sense, but it makes no sense today.

So much fail in that article.

No fact checking...like the ATP.

No mention that you could get hired with 190 hours before the 1500 hour rule, and the exceptions that rule allows.

The thousands upon thousands of qualified individuals who could fly at a 121 regional carrier but choose a better QOL at corporate, 135, cargo etc jobs...or left aviation all together.

Still doent make since, all kinds of companies go out of business, so the same mentality should be used say in construction ? So a company gos under and all the other companies are to honor hiring dates ? Could you see that, that system would undermine the moral and hard work of others ? Bottom line is **** happens, you make a bad choice or your company gos under, you move on. The surgon that moves on is only guearenteed income bases on his abilities not when he graduated med school or started working at a hospital

Two quotes completely explain the current pilot staffing woes:

"The talent always follows the money" and "No Bucks, No Buck Rogers"

Anything else is just a smokescreen.

Well can't say he is fully off base on the pay issue, but many things are factually incorrect.

Funny how we are smart enough for one list but the idea of having two lists that separates longevity pay and bidding priority is such a foreign idea.

We are not construction workers and I don't mean that in a derogatory way. Not sure of your background, but people are hired into management positions / or positions of seniority every day from outside the company. This doesn't undermine the morale or hard work of others. People are hired into positions that are commensurate with their abilities and paid a salary representative of their experience. Like the surgeon, a pilot should only be guaranteed an income based on his abilities not when he started working at an airline (hire date). :rolleyes:

I agree but that's not what your saying as far as I can tell, your saying that a pilot should be able to carry his sinority and pay scale to a new company, or am I missing something, if that's the case, let's look at it this way, you started with company x, worked very hard, did everything you could to make the company a better place, the next week two FO,s were hired that bumped you from your upgrade, because they had higher hire dates, form another company, if that's what your saying would happen in your system, is that fair, again if I'm reading it wrong feel free to tell me,

Thinking more about it, one difference between a surgeon or doctor and a pilot is that, while they're all skilled, a specialty surgeon or one with a high success rate will be especially sought after. You're recognized on an individual level. Pilots have no uniquely identifying attributes. You might suck at the job and skirt by getting violated day in and day out, but if you get the plane from A to B without crashing it and sweet talk the controller out of giving you a phone number, you're considered on equal footing with Sully. Doesn't seem right. But how could an airline gauge your quality relative to your peers? And what incentive do they have to do so?

Very true, and I'm not union bashing, but I'd bet doctors don't have or need unions because of that

No, that's exactly what I'm saying I think you're just reading it differently. There is no perfect answer. I think there would have to be some stipulations associated with the movement from one company to the next. Here are a couple of thoughts:
1) Seat locked for 1 to 2 years
2) Seniority is for pay purposes / benefits
3) No direct Captain entry
4) 10% to 20% reduction of seniority number (if you are a ten year pilot and move you lose 1 to 2 years of seniority), makes moving more deliberate.

I do understand your argument, but I can tell you as a FO who has only been at this for a couple of years and would be at the bottom of the "national" list, I wouldn't have any problem with one of my peers getting paid what they deserve.