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-   -   Nwa and DAL Rfps (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/8501-nwa-dal-rfps.html)

bassslayer 01-10-2007 07:21 PM


Originally Posted by Slaphappy (Post 101456)
from what i've been told by a very good source.

Comair will lose a totaly of 12 crj700s and 30 or so 200s
there are big losses in comairs future.

And yes Skywest is getting most of the delta rfp. By contract they get 40% of all delta flying

Skywest is planning on have over 300 airplanes by the end of the year and well over 3k pilots.
Skywest WILL be the largest regional in the world by 2008

If this is true, it seems Comair is not aware of it. Why would they be hiring all these pilots, rampers, csa, etc. if they know they are going to take such massive loses in the next month or two? I've heard 300 or so pilots by July alone. I know there is a lot of attrition, but I didn't think it was that much.

Otto 01-10-2007 07:22 PM


Originally Posted by Slaphappy (Post 101471)
the 12 700s are the ones they already lost. but they are to lose an addition 30 airplanes. either 70s and 50s or just 50s. But more loses are coming for Comair.

From what I understand they lost ALL the flying that was put up for bid

A good source at Comair said they were getting 50 crj705s so I guess it goes to show you never know until it's official.

Slaphappy 01-10-2007 07:44 PM


Originally Posted by Otto (Post 101475)
A good source at Comair said they were getting 50 crj705s so I guess it goes to show you never know until it's official.

there are no more 705s being made. If anything they would be 900s and we know skywest would get those easy

Ftrooppilot 01-11-2007 05:10 AM

PRESS RELEASE Tuesday: "Mesaba flies 49 propeller-driven Saab 340s and one regional jet. Its fleet of more than 100 aircraft was reduced sharply as its only customer, Northwest, reorganized under bankruptcy protection. Northwest said Tuesday it is "actively considering" Mesaba for flying 36 regional jets with 76 seats each."

FROM Rochester Newspaper this week: "Mesaba will take over [NWA Ground] operations first thing Tuesday and they say they expect the transition will be a smooth one. "

The same thing hapened at Flint, La Crose and numerous other stations. NWA is positioning Mesaba to be their "cost savings" operation - effectively (after purchase) a two-tier pay scale operation within NWA. Mesaba ground personel will service all aircraft while Mesaba flight crews (stilll wearing Mesaba uniforms) will fly the CRJ-900s and SAABs.

acl65pilot 01-11-2007 06:30 AM

As soon as DAL exits protection look to have them to amend the DIC contract with Skywest and delete the clause about it being ASA. It will be SKW inc. It cannot be done now with out a lot of hassle.
ASA will be in deep dodo. DAL wants the flying done by a few. Republic and SKW, and some but very little by other carriers. I think in three to five years ASA and Comair will be gone.

Otto 01-11-2007 06:36 AM


Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 101585)
As soon as DAL exits protection look to have them to amend the DIC contract with Skywest and delete the clause about it being ASA. It will be SKW inc. It cannot be done now with out a lot of hassle.
ASA will be in deep dodo. DAL wants the flying done by a few. Republic and SKW, and some but very little by other carriers. I think in three to five years ASA and Comair will be gone.

Then why go through all the legal expense of the 1113 process at Comair if they are going to be dismantled in three years?? It doesn't add up.

cyrcadian 01-11-2007 07:49 AM


Originally Posted by Otto (Post 101589)
Then why go through all the legal expense of the 1113 process at Comair if they are going to be dismantled in three years?? It doesn't add up.


Exactly! Comair will have a brand new cost structure very soon which, in all practical business sense, will open the door to new opportunities.

This whole RFP thing is a joke. A big scare tactic to get a pilot group to concede pay for growth. And look what else it does. It creates competition amongst pilot groups for crap flying. Stupid carrot. We should all say NO!

If I were Delta, I would want a cheaper Comair so I could grow them enough to sell them off in the future. Dismantling them is like taking your classic car and trashing it because it became too expensive to maintain. What you do is make minor repairs and sell it, to recoup some of your losses.

Delta isn't stupid. They want many regionals flying for them so if one screws the pooch (a la Comair 2001), they have many leftover to clean up the mess.

The RFP will be (IMHO) divided amongst the bidders.

Mosyslack 01-11-2007 08:56 AM

It has already come out in BK court that the 12 -70's that Comair lost to SkyWest were part of the purchase of ASA! The RFP is a scare tactic that is being used to get lower pay from the Comair group. Delta has already stated that the RFP is complete, but they will not say who gets what. Why is this? Is it just coincidence that Comair does not have a deal yet? Hmmm... I'm tired of playing these freaking games! Oh, and Comair is expected to post a $50M PROFIT for 2006. How can this not be a game to them to get the lowest possible cost structure?!?!?!

fosters 01-11-2007 09:08 AM


Originally Posted by Mosyslack (Post 101638)
Oh, and Comair is expected to post a $50M PROFIT for 2006. How can this not be a game to them to get the lowest possible cost structure?!?!?!

OK, this probably is going straight over my head, but regardless of the profit/loss Comair posts doesn't it go directly to Delta? Since companies like SkyWest build in a 10% profit margin, you would think that even if Comair was 9% more expensive then SkyWest on an operation basis, they should still retain flying, because Delta doesn't need them to show a profit or loss, they just need them to operate.

Not to mention, Delta gets to depreciate the Comair assets, keep direct control of the operation, and continue to build equity in their aircraft. It almost sounds like Delta is cutting off their nose to spite their face.

Now, if SkyWest is >10% cheaper, then I can see them getting additional flying, that just makes sense from a short-term view of things (disregarding depreciation and equity in assets, among other "long term" things).

Mosyslack 01-11-2007 09:24 AM

I'm not even really sure how the financial aspect of D's ownership of Comair works. We're seperate, but yet... The $50M..."is a profit only on paper", was Comair's response in BK. The most common thing that I see, is that either D or Comair uses whichever arrangement is most convenient at the time or instance. For example...when we went into BK it was "to protect us (Comair) as a Delta asset". Then a few weeks later, we (Comair) actually lost $100M the previous year.


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