|
Originally Posted by Eaglepilot84
(Post 2089076)
I'm tapping out of this thread...too many dumb arguments all the way around :confused:
As a parting shot, FirstClass, let me know how your ideological thinking works while you slave away for PSA...one of the biggest culprits for exploiting a phenomenon known as "SJS" that you yourself have fallen victim to. "NOclass" is a PSA sell-out? That explains a lot... |
Anything you earn has value to you, that which is not earned, has little value to you.
|
If we could actually strike and weren't hamstrung by the law you would see our real value overnight.
If the RLA didn't exist we would bring this ****show to a halt immediately, but we can't. The only option is to quit, and that's not realistic either. For those of us who want to fight to make it better it's definitely an uphill battle against management and lobbyists. I don't feel entitled when I tell a new hire what they can expect. If everyone here blew sunshine and rainbows up peoples asses there would be no hope for any kind of positive change either. |
Originally Posted by FirstClass
(Post 2089024)
Can anyone here illustrate what would be perfect compensation? I would like to hear this defined.
|
Originally Posted by pleasedontripme
(Post 2089146)
I wasn't trying to make this post about me. But to defend my 3 months in 121 I will give a little history.
-I flew in Alaska 135 for a number of years. -I came to 121 to get IFR experience, a jet type rating, and useful experience that I can use in the future. - I made a decision that X$$ compensation and X QOL was equal to my expectations for the work/service I am providing. -I do not have any pipe dreams about my future in the airlines, I most likely will be here for 1-2 years before I move on to continue my life goals. -I certainly know nothing about the life of a 10 year airline pilot, but I know that if I am as unhappy as many who post here after even a few months I will move on to the next chapter in my journey. I will admit that I misquoted/misspoke about the website. I am sure the intention was to provide up to date, useful information, that would benefit pilots in many ways (which I think it does, gouges, hiring status, etc) -- but the other posts that are so negative and inflammatory seem far less productive (much like this thread has gone in just a few SHORT hours). I am a nobody, with little experience in the 121 world. I was simply trying to say, that if the industry I have entered, if the pilots I work with, continue to have such a melancholy, disinterested, negative attitude -- what is it to make me/to make you stay? (the money, the glory, the dream of LEGACY?) Just seems like there may be a place where our hard work, efforts, dedication, dreams, and attributes will be more deeply appreciated/noticed than the world that is 121 Airline flying. |
Originally Posted by snackysmores
(Post 2089171)
If we could actually strike and weren't hamstrung by the law you would see our real value overnight.
If the RLA didn't exist we would bring this ****show to a halt immediately, but we can't. The only option is to quit, and that's not realistic either. For those of us who want to fight to make it better it's definitely an uphill battle against management and lobbyists. I don't feel entitled when I tell a new hire what they can expect. If everyone here blew sunshine and rainbows up peoples asses there would be no hope for any kind of positive change either. |
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles |
Originally Posted by HeavyDriver
(Post 2089236)
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles I've got a family friend that retired from SWA that says a lot of the same things you said here. But when I asked how he got there he said "Oh, I just got my pilots license and then got on at SWA." No degree, no crazy interview prep, no volunteer work, no 10 years as a regional CA, etc etc like people are having to deal with today. The older crowd has a hard time feeling bad for all of us whiney regional guys now, and I get it. But things just don't go the way they did in this industry 25-30 years ago. |
To the OP. Many have left...
After several airline shut downs (including Comair), I left. I truly miss the 121 world but would never consider going back unless pay and qol improve substantially. I still get to fly a dinky King Air but my qol has shot through the roof. I have more time off, am building an airplane and travelled to Europe 3 time last year. When the airline CEO's get a clue, I would love to jump back in. |
Originally Posted by FirstClass
(Post 2089226)
You're just making excuses. You have the power to effect change with or without the RLA. It requires balls, the type where you and like minded pilots don't care if you get fired.
|
I'm in my 20's, on track to make between 80-90k as a regional CA 3 years out of school. My friends who graduated from college with business/finance/accounting degrees are making far less.
The job market isn't great out there, and while I believe we are underpaid it isn't exactly sunshine and roses outside of the aviation industry. |
Originally Posted by HeavyDriver
(Post 2089236)
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles |
Originally Posted by FrequentFly3r
(Post 2089276)
A heavy CA in your 20s? I don't know any heavy FOs in their 20s now. Not bashing you at all, just saying that things are different.
|
Originally Posted by adspilot
(Post 2089515)
Says the guy who went running to PSA after they undercut other pilots to take their planes. And you talk about balls.
|
Originally Posted by Dhood84
(Post 2089151)
You're in the wrong business then my friend. It's full of *******s with A type personalities who throw you under the bus then back it up after it rolled over you. Thick skin is a must and you have to be able to play with the big boys.
DH If you're in a good place with a great pilot group, the people you'll fly with are the exact opposite of your description - and yeah, there's always the 2%. Anybody that flies in the left seat (or in the right seat) and acts like an as*hole can be put in their place pretty easily. Nobody should have to put up with that - and the 2% are usually the bitter and uncultured who would hate any job anyway and feel like the world owes them everything. |
|
Originally Posted by HeavyDriver
(Post 2089236)
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles |
I can see why some of you are stuck at the regional level. Sad.
|
Originally Posted by Captainobvious
(Post 2089112)
True satisfaction can only come through a proper relationship with Jesus Christ.
|
Originally Posted by HeavyDriver
(Post 2089236)
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles |
Originally Posted by flyguy94
(Post 2089521)
I'm in my 20's, on track to make between 80-90k as a regional CA 3 years out of school. My friends who graduated from college with business/finance/accounting degrees are making far less.
The job market isn't great out there, and while I believe we are underpaid it isn't exactly sunshine and roses outside of the aviation industry. It took me 10 years to make over $50k. I'm mid 30's at my fourth airline. You can think you have it made and then it's all gone... |
Originally Posted by HeavyDriver
(Post 2089236)
I must have done something wrong.
No college... No debt... Not a Major Airline... Been a captain on a widebody since my 20's... 6 figure income for 25 plus years... Never less than 14 days at home a month... Took care of my own retirement... Own my home out right... 3 NORMAL grown kids with jobs and with grand children... And I'm told constantly how much my career, QOL and airline sucks... My next door neighbor...in debt, 4th wife, one kid in jail, and works at Home Depot...(Retired from Delta)...don't get me started on the retired United guy down the street...lol I really screwed up and should have listened to everyone who knows everything about everything, instead of taking responsibility in my own future... "Luck favors the prepared...darling" incredibles Yeah, you've done something wrong alright. Thanks for the update on what the industry was like when Braniff was around, Gramps. :rolleyes: |
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
(Post 2090112)
You have grandchildren and a you're a heavy captain and you're wasting your time in the "Regional" forum??
Yeah, you've done something wrong alright. Thanks for the update on what the industry was like when Braniff was around, Gramps. :rolleyes: |
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
(Post 2090112)
You have grandchildren and a you're a heavy captain and you're wasting your time in the "Regional" forum??
Yeah, you've done something wrong alright. Thanks for the update on what the industry was like when Braniff was around, Gramps. :rolleyes: |
It is pretty easy to make your stance. When a company tries to get you to do something illegal, in the interest of increasing their profits, you simply tell them no. When the companies assistant cp calls and tells you you are selfish, stupid, etc for saying no and threatens you with your job, tell them no. They make billions off of our backs and then file by and will throw you under the bus quicker than they can hop in their Ferrari and quote a scripture. (Reverend BB pun intended). Screw that. Are we not the bread and butter to their millions? Why are they entitled to so much while paying us chump change in return? It is because we all have modern day type a personalities. What does this mean? Betas. You are all betas. To sit idly and do nothing while our bosses make triple or even quintuple our annual salaries? At what point do you draw the line and say enough? At what point do you realize we are only forced to "not strike because of RLA, excuse, excuse, etc"? Screw that. We have the right to put a stop to it and we should. Regardless, it will never happen as there are no true type a personalities in aviation anymore. Just overweight, underpaid, under appreciated, peasants that do nothing as they are trampled upon. Glad I got out when I did. I now enjoy the freedom of telling my superiors how I feel when asked to do something illegal. I tell them no. I have that freedom and luxury to do so. Thankfully, I am a respected professional and it has not come to that point. However, if it does, I stand ready to defend what I have earned and worked for and suffered for. I deserve the best this life has to offer and since this life is not a rehearsal, I refuse to live a life of mediocrity.
#rantover |
Originally Posted by HereToWin
(Post 2091920)
It is pretty easy to make your stance. When a company tries to get you to do something illegal, in the interest of increasing their profits, you simply tell them no. When the companies assistant cp calls and tells you you are selfish, stupid, etc for saying no and threatens you with your job, tell them no. They make billions off of our backs and then file by and will throw you under the bus quicker than they can hop in their Ferrari and quote a scripture. (Reverend BB pun intended). Screw that. Are we not the bread and butter to their millions? Why are they entitled to so much while paying us chump change in return? It is because we all have modern day type a personalities. What does this mean? Betas. You are all betas. To sit idly and do nothing while our bosses make triple or even quintuple our annual salaries? At what point do you draw the line and say enough? At what point do you realize we are only forced to "not strike because of RLA, excuse, excuse, etc"? Screw that. We have the right to put a stop to it and we should. Regardless, it will never happen as there are no true type a personalities in aviation anymore. Just overweight, underpaid, under appreciated, peasants that do nothing as they are trampled upon. Glad I got out when I did. I now enjoy the freedom of telling my superiors how I feel when asked to do something illegal. I tell them no. I have that freedom and luxury to do so. Thankfully, I am a respected professional and it has not come to that point. However, if it does, I stand ready to defend what I have earned and worked for and suffered for. I deserve the best this life has to offer and since this life is not a rehearsal, I refuse to live a life of mediocrity.
#rantover |
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
(Post 2092218)
So you do it, but you've never done it... Keep hittin those keys, tough guy :rolleyes:
What are you talking about? I DID do it! It was a bit un-nerving but I did it and my life is soooo much better now. It also makes things a lot easier if you have more than one source of income. My money isn't made from aviation. I enjoy aviation as a hobby that pays but I don't hesitate to put anyone in their place if they step out of line. Example: Had a Crew scheduling mgr get irate with me at my last gig for calling fatigued. Chewed me up one side and down the other. So, I hopped a js to his office. The surprised look on his face was priceless when I showed up to greet this pint sized package of dynamite. I invited him to speak that way to me now that I was sitting in front of him. You would not believe the amount of "respect and courtesy" that man showed me. It's so funny how people treat others when they can hide behind a phone/pc/etc. Their entire demeanor changes when they are confronted by those they seek to oppress. #noragrets |
How about the idea that no one is wrong here. We all see the industry in our own individual way based on our own individual experiences that have gotten us this point in our careers..wherever that may be. From left seat 74 flyin across the ponds to right seat 1900 flyin across the Rockies we all see it differently based on where we are at and our perspective. No two opinions are alike but no one is wrong. Live and let live and enjoy the show how ever you see fit based on how you see the world. Just don't bring down others simply because they may see things a bit different. Perhaps just be open enough to learn from it.
|
Originally Posted by HereToWin
(Post 2092223)
What are you talking about? I DID do it! It was a bit un-nerving but I did it and my life is soooo much better now. It also makes things a lot easier if you have more than one source of income. My money isn't made from aviation. I enjoy aviation as a hobby that pays but I don't hesitate to put anyone in their place if they step out of line.
Example: Had a Crew scheduling mgr get irate with me at my last gig for calling fatigued. Chewed me up one side and down the other. So, I hopped a js to his office. The surprised look on his face was priceless when I showed up to greet this pint sized package of dynamite. I invited him to speak that way to me now that I was sitting in front of him. You would not believe the amount of "respect and courtesy" that man showed me. It's so funny how people treat others when they can hide behind a phone/pc/etc. Their entire demeanor changes when they are confronted by those they seek to oppress. #noragrets |
Life is FULL of choices. Welcome to it. Whether it be ****, Bologna, ham, PB&J... You and only you can choose which ones you are willing to eat for someone else.
Originally Posted by Rahlifer
(Post 2092960)
Things are a little different if flying is merely a " hobby" for you and you don't give a crap about being fired and blacklisted. Most people around here hope to eventually have a career at a major which will involve lots of **** sandwiches along the way.
|
Originally Posted by HereToWin
(Post 2092223)
What are you talking about? I DID do it! It was a bit un-nerving but I did it and my life is soooo much better now. It also makes things a lot easier if you have more than one source of income. My money isn't made from aviation. I enjoy aviation as a hobby that pays but I don't hesitate to put anyone in their place if they step out of line.
Example: Had a Crew scheduling mgr get irate with me at my last gig for calling fatigued. Chewed me up one side and down the other. So, I hopped a js to his office. The surprised look on his face was priceless when I showed up to greet this pint sized package of dynamite. I invited him to speak that way to me now that I was sitting in front of him. You would not believe the amount of "respect and courtesy" that man showed me. It's so funny how people treat others when they can hide behind a phone/pc/etc. Their entire demeanor changes when they are confronted by those they seek to oppress. #noragrets |
Originally Posted by Nantonaku
(Post 2093028)
Really, you took time out of your own schedule and "hopped a js to his office" to tell him how it is? Extremely bad judgement, not only in time management but in problem solving - professional aviation is better for you not being in it.
Restorative approaches have their place and should be taken in such places. Just dropping the full weight of the hammer on somebody is not always best. Doing nothing and just "eating the $h!t sandwich" is what is truly extremely bad judgement, bad time management and bad problem solving. Professional aviation would be better if more pilots would stop doing nothing. |
Get 1200 hrs and get hired at a good part 135 single pilot turbine company. You can easily start at more than $50,000 a yr. Amazing
|
Originally Posted by pleasedontripme
(Post 2088994)
If you are one of the people that find most every aspect about the airlines, negative, why don't you leave, start a new career, make a change? I understand some of you need the money, but we all know there is no money in aviation, go do something else.
If you are one of those people that "truly loves aviation," then why do you care about the money so much? If there is no pilot shortage, why don't you move on? If the union is screwing you over, why not leave? If you are bored with 121 flying, why not make a change? I understand the purpose of this website. The ability to vent, to rip other people, to say whatever you want, and most importantly to complain about your work - it's more or less a necessity. But think of how unproductive it is? I see all these posts and I always think to myself, "what happened to personal responsibility?" What happened to the drive and motivation to be stimulated, satisfied, and driven in our work? Why are there so many of you contradicting yourselves in so many ways all the time? You only have one life to live, why spend your time disliking your choices so much? If you made the wrong choice in the past, no big deal, move on and make a better choice today. If you want to fly, fly. If you want to make a million dollars, make am million. If you want to be home every night, be home. Remember with all of your decisions come sacrifice and with all of your sacrifice comes gain. The next time you are going to post about how terrible your life is or how little money you make, (any other airline complaint for that matter,) put the computer down and take those ten minutes to think about other decisions you might be able to make in your life that might leave you feeling a little more motivated, stimulated, and satisfied. I completely understand where you are coming from, but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad. I am relatively new to the whole 121 world and ever since it has been a dream to be an airline pilot, I have heard slightly more negativity then positivity. There have even been successful pilots who were negative about the career. But, sometimes the people who are bitter and negative open your eyes to a different aspect that could benefit you in a certain way or another. But, of course there are the ridiculous people that just complain because they want things handed to them. Regardless in ever career there is going to be the bitter negative ones who want to take their negativity and bestow it on to everyone.... Just food for thought. |
Originally Posted by V1Rotate95
(Post 2097911)
I completely understand where you are coming from, but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad. I am relatively new to the whole 121 world and ever since it has been a dream to be an airline pilot, I have heard slightly more negativity then positivity. There have even been successful pilots who were negative about the career. But, sometimes the people who are bitter and negative open your eyes to a different aspect that could benefit you in a certain way or another. But, of course there are the ridiculous people that just complain because they want things handed to them. Regardless in ever career there is going to be the bitter negative ones who want to take their negativity and bestow it on to everyone.... Just food for thought.
|
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:48 PM. |
Website Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands