USMCFLYR

I'm not sure Tummy - but I wouldn't be surprised if the answer is that touch-n-gos (and probably most certainly roll-n-gos) are not procedures trained too, or practiced, in civilian turbine aircraft.
It will be interesting to see what other forum members have to offer in this area.

mynameisjim

On my airplane a go around is not recommended after thrust reverser deployment. I'd guess most wouldn't recognize brake failure prior to reverser deployment.

Tummy

That makes sense. I read this article after posting my initial comment. I think it's worth a read.

Pilot Techniques

Of particular note:

"Interestingly, thrust reversers are a mixed blessing. While obviously helping to slow down faster, they bring a pilot to a worse situation by giving him/her less time to decide if a go-around is appropriate."

rickair7777

I've done T&Gs in a CRJ, but that was planned for training purposes. Lift dumpers were double-verified NOT armed.

A go-around after TD due to poor stopping performance in a jet is almost universally a bad idea unless the airplane has specific procedures for it. Many things would doom that to likely failure...auto lift dumpers, spool up time, reverser stow time, lack of performance numbers for a rolling midfield TO. By the time you realize you need a GA, you're hosed. Better to go off the end at 20 kts than 120 kts.Typically reverse is used first down to a lower speed (80-100 kts) before heavy breaking is even applied...although you can always get on it immediately if you suspect impaired braking.

galaxy flyer

For me, if the factored landing distance comes within 1,500' of the LDA, I'm on the brakes at touchdown with the TRs coming out. Waiting til 80 knots for the brakes us asking for an excursion. Brakes stop the plane, if in doubt, remember reversers aren't part of the landing distance computation. The reason? At full anti-skid braking, the plane is slowing too fast for the reversers to help. I've landed the C-5 on glare ice (RCR of 5) and the brakes stopped us exactly as the charts said.

GF

mike734

I wish the 737 had charts for glare ice.

SrfNFly227

A lot of people are bringing up thrust reversers in this conversation and I feel it's important to note that the Phenom 100 does not have thrust reversers. It also does not have spoilers of any kind. It has anti skid, and that's it.

I no longer have the performance books, but if it was raining and they actually had the 9 knot tail wind that was reported in the NTSB report, I'd be willing to bet that stopping distance would be almost all of the available runway.

bgmann

You're pretty much correct. See post #7. From the info I gathered it was legal but close! Not leaving any room for even the slightest mechanical problem or off speed or off slope or off TDZ. Now I know we are all Monday morning QB'ing it here but we as pilots do that and trying to learn from it.

sailingfun

Cold ice actually provides reasonable traction. Wet ice is where you end up with nil braking. Many airstrips are carved out of ice for winter use. They work great with good breaking as long as the ice is cold. When the temp gets up toward 0c then all bets are off.

sailingfun

The AV8B has a very different thrust to weight ratio from a transport aircraft. At 100 knots you are covering 166 feet per second. It can take 10 to 12 seconds to get meaningful trust from a large turbo fan with the reversers deployed. Transport category aircraft also operate with far larger variances in landing weight than is typical in tactical aircraft. To figure out a go around distance would require first knowing the time to spool to takeoff thrust which is altitude and temp dependent. Now you have to factor in landing weight, flap selection,TAS, winds and obstacle clearance. In addition many transport aircraft will not rotate well at landing trim settings and if a flap retraction is attempted to TO flaps won't rotate at all.
Delta used to require touch and goes in training. It was a carefully coordinated event with flaps being retracted to TO and trim being reset on the roll. Still even on a touch and go a large amount of runway is used. Best to stick with the rule that once the reversers are deployed you're committed!