DW and BC introduced and explained the VEBA Trust as a way to fix their own retirement medical coverage costs.

They didn't even try to hide the fact that many of the rest of us might never see the same benefit. I had more than one "debate" at Union Roadshows with BC about why we (the Membership) should vote to take care of the 2 of them.

I opposed the TA for that and other reasons. But ... silly me, I also opposed AGE 65 because it was VERY BAD for me and everyone else who always planned to retire at 60. We ALL lost 5 years seniority that day (Imagine what different seat you might be in if 750 folks retired in those 5 years; how about what better training and vacation periods you might have been able to hold, better monthly bid awards? All for a few folks who didn't properly plan for retirement and don't have any hobbies they'd rather be doing instead hub-turning at night! That's sad and kind of pathetic ).

We gave the guys who were 53 when we signed that contract a bonus just because they were 53. It's a benefit that SHOULD have been negotiated for ALL of us!*?

As our Union leadership said at the time, "This one's for us and ... clink, clink ... Geesh, I love Union Politics

Easy fix. In this contract if you retire on or before age 60 you get the 30k debit card, I allowed for inflation. If you retire after 60, it's prorated. Card issued at retirement. Simple!

No, not good enough.

Every pilot, regardless of when they retire, gets the 30K.

I want the same deal they got.

Anything less, and I vote no.

It's that simple.

I'd pass on the 25k if we'd all actually show some unity. Imagine the contract we'd be offered if we all stood together and quit making excuses.

If you understood the initial purpose of that fund, you might feel otherwise, however, I doubt it. So I guess it's a NO vote for you. How sad.

JJ we still have the 60 to Medicare insurance problem. I agree that that particular Veba deal is a lost cause and our tough luck. But the moochers who negotiated the 2006 contract lined their buddies pockets with 25K at the expense of the rest of us. I am all for helping Pilots who retire pre 65 because that helps everyone, but no special deals.

You understand that advertising it as removing an impediment to retire early is only accurate if you require the pilot to actually retire.

Otherwise it is giving money to a subset of pilots. (Some of which was scope penalties that was supposed to go to the general membership)

The special deal was given to the guys over 53 in the last contract.

I am just trying to get that same deal for the rest of us.

JJ, I understand the purpose of the fund. I also understand that we would have to negotiate that benefit again in the future for the guys that didn't get it. All I am saying, is if this NC didn't negotiate to give the next generation the same deal the last generation got, then I will vote no.

I see nothing sad about that.

It's just business.

I won't vote yes, for a contract that does not treat me equally to guys that are still on the property.

Let me guess, JJ, you got the 25K, didn't you?

"I've got mine", ring a bell?

KISS......

This is very frustrating to those of us that weren't 53 on Jan 01, 2007. But, what many here obviously are ignorant about...Is that 68% of our crew force voted to "screw" ourselves, and all others not 53 on that date, out of the $25K, that needed to be renegotiated, in 2011.

And, needs to be renegotiated each contract going forward!