Boeing’s Fatal Mistake

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Quote: Boeing announced last week that the “NMA/797/75-replacement” is un-shelved and in talks with airlines. United hasn’t placed firm orders with money down. If a “797” is coming then I’m guessing it’ll be goodbye XLR.
I have no doubt that Boeing can design a clean sheet, middle of market airplane that can beat a 321XLR. No question. But, it'll take them a decade. And meanwhile Airbus is selling XLRs already.
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Quote: I have no doubt that Boeing can design a clean sheet, middle of market airplane that can beat a 321XLR. No question. But, it'll take them a decade. And meanwhile Airbus is selling XLRs already.
THIS^^^

It’s been NINE YEARS since Boeing got the KC-46 tanker contract which STARTED with an FAA certified airframe, all the tooling, and a workforce experienced in building it. The wing probe and drogue refueling stations are purchased from a Brit outfit that has already been supplying them. And yet it still has serious mission critical deficiencies including the inability to safely secure pallets, a refueling boom system that sort of sucks, and fuel tanks that leak - occasionally also yielding stray tools, rivets, and Big Mac wrappers.

So can they do a clean sheet design? Almost certainly. In a SINGLE decade? I wouldn’t put money on it.
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Quote: THIS^^^

It’s been NINE YEARS since Boeing got the KC-46 tanker contract which STARTED with an FAA certified airframe, all the tooling, and a workforce experienced in building it. The wing probe and drogue refueling stations are purchased from a Brit outfit that has already been supplying them. And yet it still has serious mission critical deficiencies including the inability to safely secure pallets, a refueling boom system that sort of sucks, and fuel tanks that leak - occasionally also yielding stray tools, rivets, and Big Mac wrappers.

So can they do a clean sheet design? Almost certainly. In a SINGLE decade? I wouldn’t put money on it.
it would take a top down change in management for that to happen in my opinion
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Quote: THIS^^^

It’s been NINE YEARS since Boeing got the KC-46 tanker contract which STARTED with an FAA certified airframe, all the tooling, and a workforce experienced in building it. The wing probe and drogue refueling stations are purchased from a Brit outfit that has already been supplying them. And yet it still has serious mission critical deficiencies including the inability to safely secure pallets, a refueling boom system that sort of sucks, and fuel tanks that leak - occasionally also yielding stray tools, rivets, and Big Mac wrappers.

So can they do a clean sheet design? Almost certainly. In a SINGLE decade? I wouldn’t put money on it.
The 787 took 5 years. From concept to production. Clean sheet. KC-46 is a completely different situation/set of problems.
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Quote: The 787 took 5 years. From concept to production. Clean sheet. KC-46 is a completely different situation/set of problems.
7 years from launch order to entry into revenue service for the 787 (April 2004- October 2011). Assuming a 797 follows that timeline it would not be available until 2028, that’s a long time to wait with 757/767s tha are already 25-30+ years old
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If the 321XLR offers the option to install dual truck mains (like the 757) then it will be a must closer competitor. Rumor is a Airbus will offer that as an option in the near future. Some Indian a320 operators already have this option.
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Quote: If the 321XLR offers the option to install dual truck mains (like the 757) then it will be a must closer competitor. Rumor is a Airbus will offer that as an option in the near future. Some Indian a320 operators already have this option.
Pardon my feeble RJ pilot brain, but given no engine/wing performance changes, what does adding a "2nd set" of wheels do for the 321 that move it closer to 57 territory?
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Quote: Pardon my feeble RJ pilot brain, but given no engine/wing performance changes, what does adding a "2nd set" of wheels do for the 321 that move it closer to 57 territory?
reduced stopping distance. Shortens required takeoff and landing distance because you get 2X braking on the mains.

240 Sux
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I'm not an engineer but, I bet that whenever Boeing comes up with a 737/757 replacement Airbus can quite easily engineer a larger wing on the 320 series fuselage and undercut Boeing's new aircraft's price while matching its performances. Not to mention they could probably keep the common type which would further undercut Boeing's position.
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Quote: The 787 took 5 years. From concept to production. Clean sheet. KC-46 is a completely different situation/set of problems.
There is no way the FAA will let Boeing do another rush to customer aircraft... If the 787 took 7, this will take considerably longer...
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