Quote:
Originally Posted by No Land 3
I hardly worked any overtime my first year, maybe six days. I only had one month where I was paid 64 hours and that was because I was lost in the system. Every other month working within my 16 day footprint I would average 90 hours. By the end of the year(Jan 1st to end of December), my income totalled over 130k gross including perdiem which was around 1100 a month. Most people report the same experience, and those who take full advantage of OT can easily see 150 to 160k. We are a happy pilot group.
How about comparing apples with apples. ATI (ABX, too, for that matter) has exactly zero true wide body long haul business. And, at least for now, K4's 767 business is very similar to ATI's. So, how many K4 767 pilots are breaking 64 hours per month without working a day off?
Couple of factors affecting first year pay.
K4 is on DOS+1, and will be on DOS+2 before long. ATI is on DOS. Advantage: K4
K4 uses a training pay plan. ATI starts at full pay from day one.
Advantage: Long term (1 year) K4. Short term, ATI, unless your personal financials can tolerate training pay for a few months.
Life after OE.
K4 has 14 days off minimum out of 30 (max of 16 days on). ATI has 12 days off minimum out of 28 (also a max of 16 days on, but in a shorter "month").
Advantage: Slightly to K4, on paper. But ATI has at least one, and in many cases, two, travel days included in those days on for the non-reserve lines of time. So if you want to look at it from an availability for duty viewpoint, ATI really has 13 or 14 days off, depending on where you live versus what/where you bid to fly. That'sa minimum!
Before lines that have 13 or 14 actual days off, and, yes, there are quite a few. On top of that, if an ATI pilot works on one of those travel days, which, again, isn't one of the minimum 12 days off, he gets paid for it. So, without working a single day off, an ATI 757/767 pilot can make up the difference between a K4 pilot's 767 pay. That's today.
Longer range.
K4 offers an advantage from the start, thanks to marginally higher rates, and that they will be on DOS+2 before ATI hits DOS+1, and the likelihood of being assigned the 747 (a prize in itself for many) with pretty much guaranteed overtime.
But if you don't want to spend your life on the other side of the planet, or if you generally prefer domestic or short overseas trips, or whatever your personal needs call for, then life as an ATI 757/767 pilot is pretty much an exact copy of a K4 767 pilot. At least for now. Who knows what the future holds? As I said in another post, better in some ways, not so much in others. But when you iron out the wrinkles, we're on the same level.
And in the end, apples to apples, ATI reaches real-time pay parity with K4 after our DOS+3.
Right now, today, all else being equal, if I were applying to both airlines, and was offered a job at both with similar class dates, and could deal with a 747 life, then K4 wins easily. Right now. The biggest difference is that Connie
creates his future. The rest of us seem to be saddled with being able to do what the present provides. Blunt enough?
ATI has managed to survive over the years, despite its best efforts otherwise. Nothing is guaranteed. But if we do keep chugging, pictures of life in the 767 at ATI and at K4 are nearly interchangeable. I'm not trying to sell anyone anything. There are warts and silver linings at both places. The only ones who can't and won't see that are the handful of noisemakers here.