TSA numbers above 100k seven days in row

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Quote: You mean "trust their governments to shoot them in the back if they don't comply"

IMO the US in general relied far too heavily on mass lockdowns in the early days, but it became very apparent, very quickly, that was overreach, that light social distancing would have a huge impact. The latter would affect some industries dis proportionally (ie us) but would not have as much of an impact on the broader economy. But a large segment of the population had an emotional backlash and went hard over the other direction, with predictable results.

Governors either didn't consider the emotional impact (or maybe just didn't care, if they had ulterior motives). Leadership is an art form, some of our autocratic party hacks didn't realize it's not as simple as giving orders to robots. Fuel to the fire was the complete lack of communication as to the way ahead... timeline, metrics, etc. My governor actually had the audacity to say at one point that the standard was something like zero deaths for 14 days. By that logic we need to get a bunch of big caterpillar machines out to tear up the interstate highway system.
The lockdowns are the only thing that saved more people from massive amounts of deaths. As far as leadership, those guys are just like you and me they’re not superhuman. This was an unprecedented event, you can’t expect them to have all the answers. What was actually surprising for everyone or at least underestimated was the ability for the US population to not take a global pandemic seriously. Governors were literally pleading for people to listen. I guess history will be the judge of all this.
Quote: What about all of Europe, how big is that? How did they keep the infections lower with more people?
closed borders, something America should take more seriously.
Quote: closed borders, something America should take more seriously.
Its ok we’re already banned from other countries.
Quote: And you can claim this how? Even the experts don’t know. Also only around 1% of the US has been infected by the virus, at least officially, and it still caused all this mayhem. Herd immunity will take a lot more than a single digit infection percentage. I think we’re going to go on like this for at least another year. Openings and shutdowns until we get it under control and then by then we will have some kind of vaccine that will help from people getting reinfected until it finally goes away maybe years from now. The last big one went away after about 2 years and that wasn’t as bad as this one.
Sweden.

Way more than 1% of the population have been exposed to this virus. The threshold for herd immunity is much lower than ridiculous 50+% numbers being bandied about because of cross immunity. We know that from Diamond Princess.
Quote: Help me out here. What happened with polio, smallpox, yellow fever, mumps, rubella .... Some are not completely eliminated but certainly no longer pose a threat in advanced nations.

As far as anti-vaxxers, the solution is proof of COVID vaccination in order to take part in modern society -- everything from entering a crowd to getting on an airplane. They keep their "freedoms" and the rest of us stay safe. This is being done in Asia.

Even Fauci is optimistic about a vaccine by next year.
You might want to go back to the ‘80s and read about Fauci’s optimism for a HIV vaccine.
Quote: I was talking about the swine flu. That went away in about 2 years.
so did the Spanish Flu.
Quote:
As far as anti-vaxxers, the solution is proof of COVID vaccination in order to take part in modern society -- everything from entering a crowd to getting on an airplane. They keep their "freedoms" and the rest of us stay safe.
Yes, absolutely. We could delineate that we've had the vaccine by sewing a gold C on the breast pocket of all of our clothes.....
Quote: Its ok we’re already banned from other countries.
what does that have to do with closing out borders? You claim Europe could do it (although cases on the rise again there) . They had it easier because they are smaller and more segregated. To compare to the US, it would be like if we were able to close every State border which we didn't.
Quote: what does that have to do with closing out borders?
It was quite humorous.
Quote: Help me out here. What happened with polio, smallpox, yellow fever, mumps, rubella .... Some are not completely eliminated but certainly no longer pose a threat in advanced nations.

As far as anti-vaxxers, the solution is proof of COVID vaccination in order to take part in modern society -- everything from entering a crowd to getting on an airplane. They keep their "freedoms" and the rest of us stay safe. This is being done in Asia.

Even Fauci is optimistic about a vaccine by next year.
with the exception of Smallpox, NONE have been completely eliminated and they do indeed pose a threat in advanced nations.

As for anti-vaxxers, I’m not even talking about ANTI-vaxxers, just people who DON’T get their vaccinations, which is at least to some extent a MAJORITY of Americans. Can you tell me when YOUR last Pertussis immunization was? Diphtheria? Ever had an HPV immunization? Heck, a majority of (non-military) people can’t tell you with any certainty if they’ve had a tetanus shot within the Last decade, and lockjaw is a really cr@ppy way to go. We aren’t Asia, and it won’t be that easy.

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...-win-over-rest

and Fauci shares my concerns that the logistic and cultural problems might stop immunization from being effective even if we get a good vaccine:


https://www.cbsnews.com/news/fauci-h...virus-vaccine/

Nor am I the only one in the world that believes it likely we may never get a good vaccine. Something like a quarter of the colds we get are due to four human coronaviruses, HKU1, 229E, NL63 and OC43 , and even after having one, the subsequent immunity seems of reasonably short duration:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....27.20082032v1

34 weeks after having a human coronavirus your chance of being reinfected by the same coronavirus is the same as someone who has never had it. That does not bode well for a ‘good’ vaccine, and it is entirely consistent with the veterinary experience with animal coronaviruses which is one of relatively poor and short-lived success.

So please forgive me, Goggles, but I don’t think that brainstorming other potential options is necessarily a bad idea.
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