Quote:
Originally Posted by longhauler
The people I have been associated with that have been ALPA would not support your statement. Most of the people who have lost millions of dollars worth of pensions (Delta, UA) or the one who lost their jobs and the company continued to operate (Emery). First ALPA is an association as it states in the title. Second professionals don't refuse to come to the table and offer help when help is needed (Some of the Delta pilots wanted to approach the company for temporary give backs when the Sh*t hit the fan after 9/11. DALPA state they can come and ask for help. Well management helped themselves to the pensions.) I have not figured out how ALPA at the regional level has helped, especially when most of the regionals are beholden to the major for their flying and ALPA majors give more total dollars to the pot than the regional guys. I think a few of the TWA guys might also disagree with ALPA also.
All in all neither is perfect you have to chose you poison, get involved and make the best of it. It will never be perfect.
Well first of all, I'm not sure why pilots blame loss of pensions and that sort of disaster on their union. Yes, unions are there to protect us, but a union can't prevent an airline from going bankrupt, and neither can a union manipulate bankruptcy laws that enable airlines to engage in such practices like cutting pilot pensions. You should blame MANAGEMENT for that.
and two, I think we all agree that neither is perfect that that you have to choose your poison, just like you said. That's why the original poster asked the question, "ALPA or Teamsters"? and that's why, your response about pilots who lost their pensions not suppporting ALPA is totally irrelevant. Teamsters wouldn't have been able to do anything for them either.
Personally, I agree with Surreal. I want to be represented by a Pilot's union, not for a trucker's union. Sure, I will have to pay .4% more dues than I would for Teamsters, but to get the legal expertise and medical resources that is SECOND TO NONE, along with their powerful political yield, not to mention everything ALPA has done for us pilots and continue to do in the history of aviation, that is worth the extra 5 bucks every month and more. I don't want some weak trucking union that can't stand up to management and won't do anything for me. I look at Teamsters' membership list, and with the except of ONE airline (Horizon) and maybe ABX (if they still represent them), they are all crappy, third rate airlines with crap contracts and crap pay. Great Lakes, Gulfstream, GOJET??? Why would I or any self-respecting pilot want to associate with a union who represents a "pay to work" airline, and an ALTER EGO airline????? I know Republic is a member, but honestly their contract isnt so great compared to other regionals of their size, and their FO pay rates suck, considering the large equipment they fly.
Regardless, what it comes down to for me is the legal and medical expertise of ALPA. The bottom line is that I want protection from management's abuses and protection for my job, and I believe strongly that ALPA can provide that for me. They are a pilot's union, and their only interest is for pilots. Teamsters could never even come close regarding legal and medical protection.
FlyJSH, I believe I've asked you before in another thread what your reasons are for supporting IBT. I don't think you ever responded.. and I am genuinely curious. If a fellow Colgan pilot has solid reasons for believing in them, I can respect that. However, if they support IBT for reasons such as "ALPA will be a conflict of interest and Pinnacle will staple us" then I can only think of that person of a douchebag, because they obviously haven't taken the time to research and think for themselves instead of listening to rumors. (Stapling is illegal and won't happen under any circumstances.)