Replace Moak? Meet the new boss... same as the old boss.

There's a point where it become the principle of it all.

You're telling me that every single member of the ALPA BOD is in lockstep with Moak and, if they vote him out, will replace him with someone who believes in the same philosophy? If that were true, I would say the vast majority of airline pilots must believe the same way, since they obviously only elect reps who believe the same way. In which case ALPA or non-ALPA wouldn't make any difference whatsoever.

Thank you Adler, 80kts, Junglebus, and PCL128. I am quite frustrated and baffled at the regional concessions wave, but I think you all bring up good points. It is easy to fall into a mob mentality at this time.

Every ALPA president since Babbitt and after has been the same. Moak however has been particularly bad (what do you expect when you elect an ex-mil DAL pilot?). So I have zero confidence that the BOD will see the light. As a BOD member who has voted in two elections, I'm here to tell you that unless you've been in the plenary session and ran the hospitality suites, you have no idea what the politics are like. It's usually a choice between several equally qualified, and equally bad candidates. and I'm still proud to say I voted for Woerth over Prater, who really sent this association on its downhill slide... Moak only turned the skid in his group's direction.

That's scary.

ALPA actively encourages the whipsaw at the regional level by signing off on concessionary deals to undercut fellow ALPA pilot groups. What is the point of a union if it's not UNIFIED.

That's all you got? A cheap insult? Ya ok cowboy.
I'm so impressed with your mud slinging on an anonymous forum.

Tell us about your inside ALPA experience.

Whoa dude...I don't think he was taking a cheap shot, he was saying that it's scary that someone who has participated in two BOD elections has such a low opinion of the various candidates. I agree, it's scary to think there are few better alternatives to Moak. It means we have a lot more work cut out for us, on a top-to-bottom scale. I fail to see how the regionals leaving ALPA changes a single thing, though. And it seems like even more work than regional guys working with reform-minded mainline pilots to reform ALPA.

edit: or maybe I misunderstood & it was a cheap shot, I see you two have been going at it in other threads.

I agree with everything you have said above, its our fault for keeping this union around. However, that agreement would not hold up in court. If ALPA collects dues from its members in exchange for representation, ALPA has a duty to its members. To represent its members in their best interest. If they breach this duty, then there may be a case. Please know that i'm no attorney and I am not well versed in the laws involved in union representation. I was just wondering if anyone out there may have proof of wrongdoing and may have run it by an attorney specializing in union law.

After all, if they charge us for a service and fail to provide in good faith, and if careers and paychecks are affected, wouldn't there be a case? There apparently was for TWA pilots.