Airline Pilot Central Forums - Does SKW honor seniority like a union shop?

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- - Does SKW honor seniority like a union shop? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/skywest/122102-does-skw-honor-seniority-like-union-shop.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah (Post 2828290)

SLC CRJ FOs have been bypassed on transitioning to the right seat of the ERJ in SLC. It's definitely been a violation of seniority. New hires last year were saying they'd only come to work at SkyWest if they could get the ERJ. The company gave those training slots to the guys off the street so they wouldn't go work somewhere else.

The new pay package has attracted a bunch of pilots and the company is now letting some of the FOs transition. Most of them have 8+ years seniority.

They did get pay protected... ^this also happens at the Majors... get use to it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828302)

They did get pay protected... ^this also happens at the Majors... get use to it...

Pay protected doesn't mean anything when they pay the same. When you can go from bidding 30% to 2-3% makes a big difference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah (Post 2828306)

Pay protected doesn't mean anything when they pay the same. When you can go from bidding 30% to 2-3% makes a big difference.

It sure does. Not arguing that. Just frustrating to see people get all bent over it. When it happens everywhere...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevjets (Post 2828241)

Many years ago, I was taking to a Skywest pilot who was complaining that her upgrade award was not being honored because her command ability was being questioned. She didn’t get the chance to go to training and told to wait a year. I have no idea what she did to pis someone off but she did say she had precious command experience in the navy, yet that didn’t make a difference. I don’t know how that would be grieved at a non-union place. Not that it would matter since the final decision rests on management and not a neutral arbitrator. THAT makes a huge difference in union versus non union. Hopefully, that was so long ago, that that practice has changed or it was an isolated incident.

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828251)

Upgrade happens based on seniority. Weather not you make it through upgrade is another question. Those that don’t it’s VERY apparent they weren’t ready...

What AMCND said.

It happened rarely, but when it did it was for VERY good reason and never to my knowledge for any reason but safety.

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828310)

It sure does. Not arguing that. Just frustrating to see people get all bent over it. When it happens everywhere...

No it doesn't. Delta didn't tell their SLC pilots they couldn't bid the A220.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah (Post 2828321)

No it doesn't. Delta didn't tell their SLC pilots they couldn't bid the A220.

Never said that was a absolute for every airline every bid. But yes. It does happen at the Majors... And no one told SLC CRJ FO’s they couldn’t bid the ERJ....

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828333)

Never said that was a absolute for every airline every bid. But yes. It does happen at the Majors... And no one told SLC CRJ FO’s they couldn’t bid the ERJ....

The difference is that you are not only pay protected at the majors. You are guaranteed the seat / domicile / aircraft If you can hold it.

If training takes too long you get positive space to and from base as necessary.

They cancel tour bid - now you can bid into any category / base you can hold - no seat lock.

Not so much here. Tell me how that all worked out for the PDX CRJ guys ?

SKYW is a great company - but the way they treat seniority in transitions is a complete and unacceptable $!it show.

And to quote RJ: “that’s how we have always done it”

Quote:

Originally Posted by TFAYD (Post 2828368)

Exactly. I blame Sapa for all that. They don’t push the issue.. would alpa be better on this issue. Probably in 5-8 years. Not immediately... when that happened to Seattle. It was 5 guys. Not 500. Yes 5 is to many. But we don’t have “hundreds” with this issue.. the biggest was SLC CRJ FO’s there were 21 people.. they have all trained or forfeited there bid..

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828386)

5-8 years? How do you figure?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevjets (Post 2828241)

Quote:

Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 2828251)

Upgrade happens based on seniority. Weather not you make it through upgrade is another question. Those that don’t it’s VERY apparent they weren’t ready...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah (Post 2828288)

I call BS. She probably went to training and then sent back to the right seat. She probably didn't want to tell you that. And many years ago it was up or out...

I've known several guys that were sent back to the right seat.. and then later upgraded after working on some things.

I'm very familiar with this particular event, as an FO the Captain's decision was questioned. Turns out the FO was completely correct and the Captain's idea was, well, retarded. The Captain in question got all butt hurt and called his buddy director at HQ and they went after blood. And yes, she was not allowed to upgrade. Got pulled down to SGU for a little attitude adjustment because she was able to show how bad the Captain's decision actually was and wouldn't relent that she had made a wrong decision.

An FO in SLC that is I think no.2 on the CRJ FO list will never get the 175 because of the retarded transition cluster developed. He is now getting 4 and 6 leg days on the 200 while other FO's on the 175 that are some 10 years junior to him are getting the primo 2 leg locals he used to be able to hold. There are new hires getting the 175 in front of him in SLC.

The seniority system has and can be superseded by company need. Nothing will change because the most important entity is happy with the results. And thus there is also PBS and that has been hurting people for so long the pain isn't noticeable any more.