Your kidding right? We had guys commuting from the west for years till we opened ORD. You guys will commute and if you fly out of EWR you will pay NJ taxes not all but most. Just ask any guy that does it now how it sucks. NJ work force tax is a favorite. Well anyway let forget about all this nonsense and get back to the argument of who's union is better. Idiots!

Here's a few more just for fun..

TWA merger with American

Pan Am furlough mess

Colgan, Pinnacle, Mesaba debacle (seniority mess/training and selling pilot group to concessions ect...)

Shall we go on?

you forgot trans states/gojets

Well there you have it...

As your decades-long aviation career collapses in smoking ruins, alpa will ensure you get some walking around money. Where do I sign up?

Now if D-ALPA had somehow gotten all of their wholly-owned CA brothers-in-unity jobs at DAL, that would have been worth some union dues... :rolleyes:

Unions suck at the regional level, and it's a conflict of interest to have the same union "allegedly" representing both majors and regionals...at least until major pilots demand one seniority list for all their brand flying.

Actually I think he pretty much was saying he is not a know it all. At least that's the way I read it.

Well then he shouldn't be making statements like this then. At least tell me why Alpa is garbage.

:rolleyes: and hence the thread finally arrives at its nadir with the good 'ol ALPA garbage/not garbage debate

Actually, it was you that said that ALPA is all I know, not me. So how is that not pretending to know about me when you don't? It was me who doesn't pretend to know about you and precisely why I asked what union you are part of. But of course you ignore the question.

I give you real life examples of what ALPA has done for the pilot groups you pointed out and your comeback is, I don't care what you said because ALPA is garbage? Can it be that maybe you are not being open minded and you already have your mind made up regardless of facts?

No, I'm sure it has NOTHING to do with Tinery or any other management personal. If you can argue that the union destroyed pinnacle, especially operating under the RLA, then you are arguing that the union is unbelievably powerful.

Sure, keep pointing out specific things that may be perceived as negative. Although positives can be pointed out such as TWA. Do you actually thing that the APA wouldn't have just stapled EVERYONE if they were non-union? Do you think that pinnacle management wouldn't have just imposed their first proposal if they were non-union?

You guys keep playing into the F&H hand by insisting that ALPA is the cause of anything that is bad at a company or that management would be more benevolent without a union. You are carrying their water!

You don't think every single one of those comair pilots wanted that "walking" money? They wouldn't have gotten it without ALPA to negotiate for it.

If you actually understood ALPA, you would understand that it's not a conflict of interest.

Look, my only point is that in all these examples, the pilots would've been worse off without ALPA. I'm not saying ALPA is perfect. NO union is perfect because they are made up from imperfect people and its people is what makes a union, not the letters in the name of it.

All I'm saying is that with a union, you have a voice. You get to suggest different things when management comes with their doozies. In all honesty, they may say, we are going with our doozie anyway. But at least you had a voice. But sometimes they may actually listen and implement a win win solution. Having a union just means you get to sit at the table and be part of the conversation and be active in the success of your company or lessen the pain in the failures of your company instead of being a voiceless spectator. Will you agree with everything your union does or wants to do? Of course not because you will never agree with everything your union leadership does. But just as you don't agree with everything your congressman, senator, or president does or wants to do, it doesn't mean that you go to anarchy. No, you vote your conscience when the time comes. Same thing with ALPA. It does good things. It is an organization that is there for good purposes. But sometimes you need to vote people out if they are doing things that are not good.

Did SkyW "buy" these? Meaning do they control them? UA also bought a few recently, but as far as I know they are unassigned. Is there a tie in here?

Yes, SKW bought them. The ones UA bought are still unassigned.