agreed but inwould have thought they could have gotten all that plus better NEC and better rates.
Like I said it's an ok contract, even pretty good, if it wasnt for the once in a lifetime situation we are all in.

I don’t know that I’d call them embarrassing because they can always offer the CARROT of flying heavy, better paying equipment to their new hires.

They would NOT be adequate for us! We don’t have those shiny marbles to offer. And, I don’t want to hear talk about abilities to fly premium time, blah, blah, blah! I don’t belong to a cartel, have no interest in belonging to one, and my circle of buddy buddies is not that big. I have no interest in picking up flying all over the system to make the money I need to make. Our normal compensation should give the vast majority of us the ability to have very comfortable financial lives.

I spent the day streaming the SWAPA podcast. Dang - you guys and gals have been through the ringer. Its a bit deflating frankly.

My apologies here for stepping on some obviously open wounds.

Curiosity killed this cat.

Take care.

Thought you wanted a job here.

Deleted. SS4M

THIS.

Good grief the Stockholm syndrome is bad around here. The Delta AIP may be good for them, I don’t know all of there other work rules. I can tell you this. We don’t have long call reserve, meals, uniforms, dropping trips, etc. We sacrifice for efficiency and that has a value to the company. If we are setting Delta rates as the standard or as a goal, then we are selling ourselves short. Pay me / provide the rest of the Delta accoutrements then.

SWA enjoys many efficiencies at a cost to me. I’m OK with that, but expect to be compensated (share in) those savings.

This mentality of having to give up something to get something. Our contract is a pie, want a piece of blueberry, scoop out a piece of apple to make room. BS.

Lastly, this “hourly flight Pay”. Pilots are so ego driven, they enjoy saying “I make $240 an hour” look in the mirror and smile. I put in a 11 hour day and got paid 6.5 TFP. So roughly $75 an hour. That’s what I get paid. So yes, I think we can do better.

I know plumbers making more then that for an 11 hr day. Twice that on a Saturday/ Sunday. Let that sink in.

We may be better of under federal work law. Seems being unionized is benefiting the company more then us.

Spoke to a bud a the Deltoid and he was a yes vote. He said there were many details that would be QOL and W2 gains that had a value to him.

(comment at large)
We have a pittance of those QOL trappings here, and the company benefits from that tremendously. I’m fine with that, and appreciate the “high speed, low drag” approach, but let’s not compare our pay rates with Delta as apples and apples.

This post is eye-opening. When the dust settles with all these negotiations I need to sink my teeth into SWA's contract. As a DAL guy it's been interesting to see the difference in reactions between different pilot groups (particularly SWA and UAL) on how the recent news of our AIP has been received. The focus for many here (which I share) has been on further improving QOL, very likely due to a predominantly young pilot group. I wonder if that skews toward pay at SWA.

I’ll bite on some of your concerns. As a more middle of the road guy myself, I believe some of the reality gets lost in the union rhetoric. I too am concerned about something breaking in the economy and a severe slowdown. Whether inflation remains high or deflation sets in, is a question most economists can’t agree upon. That doesn’t change the current state. This is the most in demand pilots have ever been, and likely will ever be again. That equals leverage that we can’t afford to pass on.

1.) We don’t expect to be paid 20% more than DAL/AAL/UAL, but to be compensated for being the most efficient pilots in the industry. The average SWA pilot flies hundreds of hours and legs more per year than our peers. We don’t have the option of other high paying wide body aircraft to go fly or even a quick upgrade to captain (8 years). We need to factor this into negotiations so that we can attract and retain high quality pilots. This benefits both parties.

2.) Inflation has eaten into our wages the last 3 years while the company has locked in wage prices for us until we get a contract. This is unacceptable for much longer while the pilot demand is so high. This is also why retro pay is so important.

3.) We all want this company to succeed and grow while also improving our pay and efficiency. Beneficial to both parties. All major airline contracts are linked and have to go up in this environment together and will share some level of parity. We have helped this airline achieve our investment grade credit and balance sheet throughout the years. An airline like American is really going to struggle to keep up with pilot wages during the next downturn with their junk credit and debt levels.

4.) Many people and other employees see current captain salaries or their demands as unfair or too high. What they don’t see is the decades that many of us put into this career making 20-30K a year flying RJ’s/Props while buried in debt, or military service being shipped all around the world. You are paying a pilot not for what they are currently doing, but the experience that it took to get to where they are. As each of the 4,000 flights a day take off, how much is it worth to have the best pilots protecting the $2 Billion dollar liability of every flight. This isn’t us being greedy, but realizing a pilot’s value in this current environment.

So, like other have said, are you guys going to get a contact anytime soon and show us how it’s done? Or are you just going to sit around and complain how Delta and Alaskas aren’t good enough? Then try to blame us for you failure?