Caveman

http://www.seattletimes.com/business...nts-next-year/

Sr. Barco

Still Flying-

Back on topic to address your original question. I know very little about cargo flying so I’ll just share some thoughts about SWA to add to the mix. Like others have said on APC you will work at SWA, especially in the beginning with little seniority or vacation. I recommend you make all of your financial projections based on mid 80’s TFP. SWA has an insane system for picking up open time should you choose to. Most OAL pilots wouldn’t even believe the trip totals some guys turn here. I’m at the opposite end of the spectrum. I try to fly only min rigged trips and PM’s only. I accept the lower pay because, barring the inevitable re-route/JA, I’m always well rested. The day after flying a min rigged 3 day trip is like you weren’t even at work compared to the day after a 26+ TFP 3 day where you feel totally wrung out. Keep in mind that a typical min rigged 3 day will have TAFB of only about 55 hours.

Some hard data for you to consider is this strategy produces about 490-510 block hours per year, about 105 days of flying and 1,050-1,100 TFP for the year. This is with 4 weeks of vacation and a few inevitable sick calls. Here is my list of what I consider to be big plusses of working at SWA. Others might find these to be negatives.

1. Pure AM/PM flying. You can keep your body clock very consistent
2. Choice (so far) to fly domestic only, 48 states
3. With little seniority you can have great QOL- 18 days off is easy to get
4. Somewhat flexible trip trade system- currently worse than in past years but OK
5. Lots of domicile choices
6. Rock solid financials Southwest Airlines
7. Ability to (theoretically) give away to 0 hours or pick up to 117 limit
8. Stated goal of 10,000 pilots on seniority list in the next 5-7 years I believe

As a side note I have a few friends at UPS and they absolutely love it. They also admit they're addicted to coffee and sleep aids. Everything has a tradeoff. Feel free to send me a PM if you want more detailed info about SWA. Good luck!


PS: I like muffins too.

Kapitanleutnant

Nice post Sr. Barco!

Thanks for the info.

K

Stitches

I know it not intentional but this part of your post is somewhat misleading. It takes 10 years to get 4 weeks of vacation. Junior guys are going to easily avg 95-105tfp whether they want to or not and the vast majority of FO's don't fly only min rigged trips since their pay rate is significantly lower than yours.

e6bpilot

Apples and Oranges. My friends at FDX are all super happy, as are my friends at SWA. It's two different types of flying (altogether) and what is good about one company isn't necessarily good about the other.
There are many similarities, though, and vacation drop and some of the flexibility that we enjoy at SWA have a similar flavor at FDX. They also have some amazing pay and work rules that allow them to be paid pilots on retainer for much of the year.
I will personally always wonder "what if" since my first choice was FedEx for a long time, but they didn't call and SWA did. I am very happy at SWA and it has all worked out nicely, though.
I will say that as a commuter, I don't think there is a better airline to work for than FedEx. The ability to have a confirmed ticket to and from your trip for many pairings is a huge benefit.

Sr. Barco

Correct on all counts. That's why I made sure to provide all of the underlying data. I still recommend for the long run to plan mid-80's TFP so as not to get addicted to POT. Just my opinion.

Sr. Barco

It really is apple and oranges. I'm trying to provide the OP with some good data and real life experience from SWA. This combined with the same from FedEx pilots is extremely valuable. I think overall FedEx pilots fly less and make more money but their flying spans the entire clock.

As another data point a good friend of mine at UPS is a 20 year line holder ANC Captain. I'm a few years under the 20 year mark. For the past 2 years we have both flown about 500 block hours. He has worked about 10 days a year more than I have. He worked 8-12 day trips but consistently had very long stretches of days off and/or vacation. He has made $80,000 to $100,000 a year more than me. However he says at TOD on a typical Asia-Europe flight the entire crew is hanging in their shoulder straps simply trying to stay awake and make coherent radio calls.

It's all about trade offs. Good with the bad...

Thunder1

Quite a bit off on your 10K pilot projection at SWA -- it will be way before 5-7 years. We currently have 8749 on the list with another 365 new hires this year and 765 in 2018. Minus 185 retirements by end of 2018 puts us at about 9700 by the end 2018. We will break 10K pilots on property within the next 24-30 months -- assuming no major economic downturn of course.

Stitches

I haven't heard any hiring numbers for next year, maybe I missed it. Was 765 from Rocky or somebody else?

Tenacvols

When I was going through new hire training back in February, we were told 785 in 2017 and 1000 in 2018. I believe it was CL that told us that. Not sure if those numbers have been updated since then or not, the limiting factor is the new training center opening up on time.