What's really insane is trying to square the first paragraph with the second. How can there be a shortage when we're...apparently...successfully...holding out for TT's like that? :confused:

(Also makes me wonder how on earth they actually deemed to hire my dumb, inexperienced, civilian, non-LCA arse 19 years ago...when there supposedly wasn't an epic "pilot shortage" going on! :eek:)

Best of luck to those still waiting for the call. It's got to start changing for the better here pretty soon! :cool:

There's no shortage at the majors (yet). The regionals? Sure.

Southwest has got to have at least 10k "qualified" apps on file with a turbine pic requirement still in place. Why would they ever consider abinitio? There are something like 18-19k regional pilots out there and almost 1k mil pilots separate every year. I don't see SW/Dal/AA or United ever having trouble hiring. Spirit, Frontier, and Atlas may start to have trouble in the next few years.

I think you are overestimating the number of qualified apps are out there. Especially when you consider those same people are also applying at every one of 4 majors, 2 freighters, Alaska, Hawaiian, JetBlue, and maybe Spirit, Frontier, and Allegiant. Divide up all of the qualified applicants and there aren't enough to go around.

The ones that are left are either unhirable, have a blemish on their record, or are the type of guys who screw around on guard. [emoji849]

Bottom line, they're looking ahead. I don't love the idea of abinitio. But I'd rather that than the airlines growth stagnant due to insufficient pilots.


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Just one week left until the window opens.
According to this site SWA window opens 4/22-4/24

Https://swa.pilotcredentials.comhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...e187166dd5.jpg


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Zap, I agree with your comments. Question, is Higher Power still the preferred 737 type provider due to purported "in bed with SWA" or where would you get a type ?

How many not-at-SWA and not-already-at-a-major 737 type holders are out there? Can't be that many


Me:

• 4 year degree
• Partial MBA but ran out of money. GPA for completed MBA work = 3.8
• ATP/MEI, 5000 TT, 1700 Turbine PIC, Part 91 ops. Part 135 cancelled checks 20 years ago in a Navajo
• Check Airman
• "Staff jobs" / management-leadership roles in my aviation department. Not a "line pilot" who flies everyday. Involved in safety, SMS, etc.
• No 121 time
• No 737 type
• Will be age 50 when/if hired
• Live in Dallas, TX.
• Considering "waiting at Envoy" and earning AA flow-thru-time and 121 time while my app sits in stack at SWA. Current $125K Part 91 corporate job w weekends off kinda is hard to walk away from tho.

Also Considering applying for SWA non-flying job in safety section, FOQA Analyst, business side/marketing (college background...) to become an "internal hire"

Recommendations ? Get the type to "get noticed" ? Join a regional to check the 121 box ?

Thanks

Probably not since, according to their website, HPA doesn't offer the 737 type rating anymore... A320 now.

The 737 type is no longer required.




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I plan on asking the 737 type question at the job fair this week, I know it's not required but I want to know how much it will help.

When I interviewed a few weeks ago, I don't think any of the 16 (8 morning, 8 afternoon) had a 737 type.

Please ask. thank you sir

I went to the last job fair and this was asked. Rocky said they prefer folks don't get the type, as they usually go to the cheapest place and end up with -200 training and have to be retrained since the systems are apparently different. Hopefully this next job fair is the way to an interview!

I just finished class last week. 22 of the 28 in my new hire class did not have the type.


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Wow, thank you.

So in a very short amount of time Southwest has gone from "you must have the type" to "please don't have the type". Wow. Starting to think I should just conveniently forget to list my type rating. (Kidding)

He did mention that the type is still valuable and that it wouldn't go unnoticed, but they've learned that the ones without it don't need the retraining that typed applicants do.

I have a type and I guess technically just by going through SW ground school I am getting "retrained", but it's not like I have to do more work than the guy without it. In fact, you get several more days off in training while guys are prepping for their orals.

Might just be the person or that they got the type 10 yrs ago. I really doubt the type makes you a candidate for retraining even though sw does it different than anyone else

What does sw do differently from anyone else?

Or dont go out and get the cheapest type, with no time in type. My sources say if you are typed and operating, its still a very valuable box to check. That being said, Im typed with time in type and no call yet ;)

I got the type 12 years earlier flying 300s and 400s for another airline. Didn't cost me anything out of pocket. Don't think it made a difference.


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The hardest for me was the pilot flying centric calls. Meaning instead of PM saying positive rate and then PF saying gear up, opps landing gear up, the PF tells the PM what to do and leads the call outs. The call outs are different. Some focus on little things that others don't do that people get wrapped around the axles trying to remember to do rather than fly the plane.
I thought training did a good job and will definitely use any and all resources to get people through. Some might need a little extra and that's ok.

SWA has its little quirks in the way it does things for sure. Some of the stuff is rooted in the old days and just won't change until some of the codgers leave. For the most part, though, I find everyone to be pretty standardized and I think the new training pipeline has added a lot of value to new hire training vs the old check in the block system that we had a couple of years ago.
There was a bubble of training failures right after the type requirement went away. That has subsided and failures are really low. Bottom line - if you put out a minimal amount of effort and study the stuff you know you need to, you will do just fine. If you struggle and want to be here, you will get the help you need.

Late last year they changed the program, finally recognizing that doing things likw teaching systems in three days was not effective. To be fair, this was the legacy of everyone coming in with a type, and they are putting quite a bit of effort and money into making training better.

They taught systems? [emoji848]


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As a matter of fact, there have been times in the past where candidates were required to be typed to interview, not required to be typed to interview (but then have to get it once the job was offered), to type not required but preferred, to not required.

In my opinion, just over a year ago we were still filling classes with many typed pilots. The actual 737 class time was more like a recurrent course, which made it tougher for the non-type folks.

Since then, the numbers are opposite and the ground school has been changed to try and better accommodate non-typed pilots.

To say that typed pilots are a problem isn't accurate--it's a combination of factors, more accurately a dynamic shift in training requirements.

I was typed at United, and yes SWA does things a little differently from them. Each airline does--but it doesn't change the way the airplane works.

Fortunately (?) I did the type on the NG, but not sure if that matters to SWA or not. But no time in type. As a low time mil guy I did it for several reasons: targeting SWA, combo with getting my ATP, GI Bill paid for it, thought it would be fun (and it was!), check another container on the app to make the computers happy, etc. It would stink if my intent of showing SWA my interest ended up backfiring, but I have to take Rocky at his word that it's still looked upon favorably. I'll be at the job fair in Dallas this Saturday; hopefully get positive feedback from the recruiter about it.

Morning or afternoon? Maybe I'll see you there. Afternoon for me. Live in the Dallas suburbs so driving in.

I got about 1,000 hrs on type still current, would I be a candidate?

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