Reserve
 

Can you guys give me the quick and dirty on reserve life at Spirit? I live in DFW, but realize it would take a while to get back here, so I would be commuting to reserve.

I guess my two biggest questions are:

Can you proffer for flying on reserve?
What are the duty periods for reserve?

DFW currently has 03:00, 08:00, 10:00 I’ve seen 19:00 before but not currently. And we have long call.

you don’t proffer but you can put yourself on the “call me first list”

14 hour rsv windows... not a duty period...

Reserve
 

3 hour call out for short call. 14 hour for long call.

In my experience I feel the early morning RAPs get used the most. It’s not that bad if you have a decent place to stay or live in base. It’s somewhat rare to get the “good morning, be at the airport in exactly 3 hours” phone call. But reserve is reserve and it sucks as a commuter.

Reserve here is pretty on par. Sucks as a commuter, not bad if you live in base. DFW reserves don’t fly as much since everyone from other bases is constantly sucking up the open time here. Because of that I’ve done 3 months of long call this year and flown one trip.

Being junior just inherently sucks - unless you just move to your initial base. Even if you live in an NK base, you are unlikely to get it right out of training after the long training stoppage - at least until a few more vacancy bids have gone by. So you either commute to reserve - because reserve is all you can hold anywhere - or you uproot and move your family to a place you can then take reserve from home to avoid 4-5 months commuting to reserve.

The real problem’s just being junior, and everyone starts that way.

Yup. I have been commuting for 3 years. Commuting to reserve sucks, but it doesn't last forever.

Are you saying just because classes have not finished behind you? In relation to training stoppage?

Nope. I’m saying you are looking at a year gone by where people senior to you have been locked in place awaiting a vacancy/upgrade bid and not being able to make the changes they want to make - especially the last few classes that they did get through.

Everybody senior to you is going to have to get to their base of preference before the new guys/gals. That’s the way it has always been. It’s just been a lot longer than usual since anyone could move so the pent up demand may make it entirely possible you won’t get your base of preference for a few months.

And compared to other airlines, that’s not bad at all. At some of them a newbie might wind up seat-locked into an airframe that doesn’t service the city he/she lives in even if the airline does have a base there.

Seniority is a two edged sword and everything is a trade off. The work rule that lets NK line holders drop lines easily is great IMHO, but the downside is that the junior people are going to sit reserve longer in order to give senior people that option.

Now none of that means you CAN’T get your base of choice out of training - and likely most of the later classes after the first ones complete durning the Spring likely will. But there are no guarantees that happens. And before it does, a few people who have been sitting reserve in a base that wasn’t their first choice for over a year that are senior to the newbies are going to get their chance to move to their base of preference first.

Ok that’s cool. I’m happy those pilots are getting to potentially move around again. I’ve spent the majority of my career on reserve out of base. The family and I have already made up in our minds I’ll be commuting to reserve for at least another year.

What is the selection process for reserve callouts? At my regional, we have a hierarchy that starts with calling out people who are already out first, then a number of things, and then you can preference first/last out in PBS. Can you do it in a similar way at Spirit?

Generally, Long Call gets called first. Inside of long call callout (14 hrs) the Short call priority is based first on how many days of availability you have vs how many days the trip is. If a 3 day needs coverage then it will first go to someone with 3 days remaining. Seniority among multiple with the same days available. After that it's PFM.

If you want to be called first, you can designate yourself as such on Flica. That list goes in seniority order.

It's fewest days available first, followed by seniority next, obviously depending on the length of the trip. We don't use the first in/last out deal here.

So does your seniority get you called last or first?

Both...haha...

"within each group, rank those pilots electing to be called first, senior to junior, followed by the remain- ing pilots, junior to senior."

So if you want to fly, its senior to junior, not wanting to fly its the inverse. But as stated, If I have 3 days available and a junior pilot has 4 days available and a 3 day trip comes up, my phone will ring. If I have 3 days available and a junior pilot has 3 days available and a 3 day comes up, they will get the call, even if they just came off a trip a day prior. The one caveat, sometimes rare, is if the junior pilot will credit about 72 hours, then the schedule can bypass them for another pilot.

SlimBob basically said the same thing I did.
I dont know what pilotnicco means by "fewest days available first"

You were endeavor right? The difference with call me first here is you can change it per day of reserve a couple of days out. Unlike 9E where if I remember you were it for the whole month.

Awesome, thanks for taking the time to explain it.

You summed it up perfectly, but I was basically just referring to what you said. If you have 1 day left, they're more likely to call that person vs someone with 4 days left. Assuming it's a day trip or something.

It behooves them to keep max options open. E.g. I thought I was gonna get a trip assigned, but they gave it to an LCR, and kept me, on SCR, available.

Which is why when on reserve, never answer the phone when they call. Let them leave a message, and you can use your call back window to verify it’s a legit reserve assignment, if not, you can call back and discuss. If it’s legit, you can call back and accept. Nothing worse than answer a phone at 3am and trying to process if you were the legit person to get tagged with that trip.

Ive put them on hold for a couple minutes while I’ve verified. If they’re going to call me at 2am, I have no problem verifying it’s correct.

I would love for my missed call answering deal to be the same hold music they play. They can’t record a voicemail till they hear at least 1 full loop.... Fair is fair....

Previous company. Whatever way you went through the menu, no way to talk to a scheduler, just “email us”, “leave a message and we will call you back” & “contact your Chief “. Changed my voicemail to:”Hi, this is me. If this is CS, listen carefully, my menu options have changed. If you want to give me my go home flight info, leave a message. If you want me to extend, no thanks “ or something like that. Didn’t go over too well.....

Luckily I can count on one hand the number of schedulers I would like to screw with on a call.

Reserve here is no treat. No different then a regional. If you are a Line holder, it’s a world of a difference.

It used to be epic, needed great seniority to hold it...

Junior on rsv sucks. Senior on rsv is great still. Problem is most folks can hold lines before they get senior on rsv so they never experience the great and just assume rsv sucks.

Suck is defined mostly by the RAP youre on and the days of the week you’re on it. Also by the the seniority of the folks on that Rap and those days with you.

That said there has been a bit less of a customer service vibe from schedulers in the last year or so. I wouldn’t say blatantly violating the contract but more like like of training and having to work the FAs too. Then when you politely raise a concern it’s not as friendly as in the past. We need pilot only schedulers and we also need all of us to know our contract so when the next guy who does know it isn’t met with resistance when he raises a concern.

I think reserve is going to be pretty rough this summer.

Rough how? In terms of being used every day, yes I would agree. In terms of it paying for hotels, well it should be a great time to save money lol.

Hes probably talking about in terms of people thinking they can bid reserve and get the month off. Gravy train is over!

What is RSV length in the junior base running now that hiring is picking up?

I’d be surprised if the new hires have even hit the line yet…

Too early to tell, but historically the further West the base the more senior (With DFW edging out LAS).

The first new hire class is currently doing IOE

if you bid the wrong rap and are junior probably going to get used. KNOW YOUR CONTRACT and be polite on the phone even when they’re wrong. Bid the right rap and the right days and be senior probably won’t get used much per usual.

If I can break guarantee I’m all for it, hell anyone want to forward their scheduling calls to my phone that’ll be swell. Gimmie gimmie gimmie.

Right RAP makes sense, but what are the right days once you've dodged a holiday?

We are a leisure airline. When do most leisure passengers fly and when do most sick calls happen.


Again, by the time people can hold the good RAPs on the correct days of the week and month they are usually well into being a line holder. Commuters obviously aren’t going to stay on rsv understandably. Even when people know the name of the game is seniority in this industry they shuffle around to stay junior.

junior rsv to junior line holder, then go to a more senior airplane to be junior all over again (not at spirit obviously).

Get senior on something and stay senior is the game. I’d wager in base rsv at most airlines outside the regionals and southwest is better than “most” lines “most” months. Now if you can hold 7-8hr turns only 9 days a month it’s a different story.

You do have less flexibility on rsv than a line holder under our current contract but again if you’re senior you’re getting pretty much what you want so the need to be flexible is less so. Instead folks go bid mid pack line holder for flexibility they didn’t really need and then spend the entire month trying to trade away trash.

I don’t know maybe I just grinded so hard as a line holder and a commuter for so many years I just really don’t want to be at work that much anymore. Especially with covid, and the masks, and the fights, and the van rides, and the constant risks to your certificate, it’s all very exhausting. Or maybe I’m just trying to get more people to bid rsv to get a better line.

Days off
 

How many days off are you guaranteed per month on reserve and how many days are in a typical reserve block?