Yes I was. I was right too as Nedskid pointed it out. He did not even include the soft money into the equation which we have quite some.

Here is a serious question for you: Are you guys at least considering a union? I actually want to know the answer to that. Yes or No will do.

What is on the long app?

It's like airline apps.com. Full employment history, logbook totals etc...

Yes.

Last union drive failed due to a technicality on signatures and dates on the union drive cards. Stupid mistake, and it reset the clock one year before another union drive.

You really had to go there? Then I'll address it:

BS if you think a FO at my seniority makes 20% more at Spirit. As a second year FO, I had them beat on first year pay. And the guys who started at NK at the same time I started here, they are on reserve at FLL. For May I credit 100 hrs with 15 days off. $70/hr is a little better than the 67.54 /hr my 2nd year friend gets, and he is still reserve 2nd year FO. Reserve is still reserve no matter how you cut it. 3rd year I'll be 80 and he 76.21. Congrats on your conflicts, trip removals, and some guys crediting 115+ hrs. I don't care, I'm happy with my schedule. I never worked a day that I needed off, because I got it off.

As for staffing, the main reason is your conflicts in PBS and removals associated with that. The company has to staff more because of that reason. Otherwise you'd be similar-sized. I'm glad you have the conflict rules, it serves you well and you bank on that $$ big time. Congrats. I don't have conflicts like that, but there are still goodies here. 3 weeks vacation in your 2nd year. No other airline has 3 weeks that soon, so it's a nice perk. 1 week off vacation you can easily get 3-4 days off on both sides so it's really 2 weeks off from each vacation week. I got 2 personal days per year which I pre-assign to guarantee me that off. Those personal days are in addition to 3 weeks vacation.

As for the payscale and longevity comments, of course. VX started flying in 2007 so you have to keep it relative. Most junior CA at VX was hired Feb 2010 and is at $126/hr (a hypothetical 3rd year CA today at Spirit would be at 107/hr yikes). Your negotiating capital was spent at the years 7 and beyond for CAs, because that's where junior CAs were anyway. Capital was not spent on Captains year 1-7. Although it seems now finally at DOS+3, the lower level longevity steps of CAs takes a serious hike. You sold out your FOs first year, 38.50/hr duration of contract = yikes. Your 401k is nice, ours sucks.

Is there really a point to all this? The theme is: a comment is made on Spirit's fees or business practice. Certain (and I literally mean the same 3 of you) NK pilots take it personally, and attack with "I make more than you" comments.

It's all relative. I'm glad you enjoy what you have. I enjoy what I have. Why can't we all leave it at that. So what if one group has one thing, the other has another? As I said my exact counterpart at NK is a FLL reserve FO. He beotches plenty. Hell, I know junior Delta pilots and they complain plenty too.

It's all relative. Who cares. Seriously.

Obviously you do, since you cant stop flapping your gator, go back to your loo.
It just seems to us all (APC) that wherever you go to comment, is just to start some cr0p about something or to defend the inability of your beloved virgin to break a profit and come out of the closet.

Yup, one of the 3 mentioned above.

I'm not sure what airline Shyguy hates more, Pinnacle or Spirit, lol

Never hated Spirit. Traveled on them, like them, I've been treated nicely. My comment on a certain fee (unintended consequences of DOT regulations) set off butthurt and attacked with pay and profitability snapbacks. But it's the same 3 people, so nothing new there.

Hmm... Wonder if I posted on the VX board "How do you guys expect to turn a profit, giving everything away for 'free'? What a BS business concept". Think I'd get a little blow back from your fellow Virgins?

One point on the staffing. I don't know how many hours per day you guys average per plane, but we fly the heck out of them. Transition is nice, but the high block is all month long.

Funny, you keep coming back with questions about things that pilots can't control, half the time we some of us don't have the answer, nor we care to know. And we are gonna keep dishing it to you sweetheart, I myself don't feel sorry if you are offended. Grow up.

...any of you other NK pilots flown with ex-Virgin guys? They are amazed at how full NKs planes are but how "crummy" NK crew lounges are, aaaah go figure:rolleyes:

Welcome to the "JUNGLE" baby!!!!! .......we gots funds and games

Pilots do the same job at either airline, point A to point B. Many want to show how smart they are to have made some brilliant career moves, but really its all about luck. Back in the '07, '08 timeframe there was a lot of turmoil at Spirit and some of our pilots left for the promise of greener pastures at Virgin America. Maybe Shyguy will fly with them and ask if they regret their choice.

On the subject of staffing, Spirits planes spend a lot more time actually airborne, generating revenue. I think this is the main reason the staffing is different.

Also Spirit is an airline that the press, people in general, and even some pilots love to hate. The various fees just feed the fire, doesn't matter that a savvy consumer can avoid the fees they don't want to pay. As pilots it doesn't impact the performance of our job, except perhaps that there is a lot of hiring going on and upward mobility.

I have. He misses the VX structure and image, but the free matching luggage the most.!
He's here because he wants to UG and make more money. (What a concept, every pilots idea of a job),
I said welcome and enjoy the ride with all of us buddy...

The VX fella Who was hired around when I was hired said the training here was superior in many ways. He also couldn't stand the arrogance they had over there, especially considering their lack of success. he did enjoy the crews and the quicker starting CFMs, lol

in other news, I got to fly 620 today, it literally smelled like a Brand new car, lol

[QUOTEin other news, I got to fly 620 today, it literally smelled like a Brand new car, lol[/QUOTE]

Couple of LGA, Haiti and red eyes turns will change all that!, but glad to know they keep coming.

^, hahaha, very true. It was interesting doing the walk around and looking at the Fan blades etc..........it's so clean, lol

This isn't the Spirit board. It's for everybody. The comment was on ONE particular fee... not on the entire business model. Leave it to the "vocal three" to get ****ed off. I hear stories about them on the Spirit board, yikes some people take it real serious and personal.



You mad, bro?

Hey, hey, hey....Don't go around calling me rational. It'll ruin my rep.:p

Good. Good luck with the next one!

As far as the pay goes, you were the one who went there by misquoting me. But fine. I flew 860h block and made $127k (not inlc. per diem) as a senior 5th y fo. That is like what? $147 per block hour? I still had one full month completely off and another one half off toward the end of the year. A year prior I made a little over $100k I think $105k and I started that year on reserve, I also flew more like 960 block that year. Still about $110ish per h. I am not sure this would have been possible over at VX but this is still possible here. Btw those numbers were no records, some guys made way more but they did so by walking all over the contract. But that is a different story. Also, let me point out that it was my choice to work extra. I could have just picked a senior line and give away my trips on FLICA and fly nothing, and make nothing. Here that is an option as well all the way to 0 block.

Next, we also have 8% matching at a 100%. That is an 8% over our pay rates basically. So yes. Even if you get only two three transition conflicts here, and you put that 8% into your 401k you already made that 20% over VX. Unless you guys have 8% too. I am just looking at the apc profile and I don't see it.

The one thing I did not do, I did not worry about what fees our pax are paying. The fees are disclosed for those who are willing to read. As someone pointed it out, they are exercising their free will when purchasing a ticket.

And bro, as far as jumping you. You are the one who has 2000 posts not me. You were the one who made the comment about a BS fee not me. Now you are trying to make it look like it was just a comment. Your comment was a BS comment and you can't backpedal enough to make it look any different.

You will never see me making a comment about your airline without provocation. Most of us just go to work and wish the best to our fellow pilots all the way from the guys busting their ass in a 152 teaching students to the guys holding the most senior lines on a wide body at a legacy. So good luck to you over at VX.

Yeah ours is 5% to 100% (not 8) so it does suck.

"You were the one who made the comment about a BS fee not me. Now you are trying to make it look like it was just a comment. Your comment was a BS comment and you can't backpedal enough to make it look any different."

It is a BS fee because of its title. But, you vocal 3 took it too personally. You mad too, bro? I hope not.

Please stop saying, "you mad,bro" it's making me cringe...............

I am not mad, just tired of you immaturity level. And definitely you are not my "bro", stop calling people you don't know that! It isn't appropriate, didn't they teach you that at Virgin Manner School, what would SIR RB do?

Through some more cash at it!

No doubt !! Silly me

Can a newb get LAS ?

Eventually. Currently running 4-5 months, but ORD opening has mixed things up a bit.

Or start crass adervtisements and charging BS fees for everything. Oh yeah you mad bro!

Have you seen your own writing style, sentence structure, and grammar? Did you go to college?

You three flip out very fast and get defensive even faster.

Any New Hires get ORD?

I did actually, not in the US since I'm not originally from here. That's all you have, a personal insult.not very VX brand of you Shy!
I'm definitely not as trouble as you are, it is surprising that a brand like VX would offer you employment, but i guess some do get by the strainer.

People have no problems with opinions about NK, but you find ways to create conflict and it's very annoying. But that's you!.

I said an unintended consequence of DOT rules fee was a BS fee. It is, the title itself is ridiculous. That's all I said, I didn't attack your model, or you personally. Just ONE fee.

Based on how quickly you flip out, then get defensive about your company, while simultaneously attacking mine, I could argue the same about you. I haven't come across any other pilots besides "the three" here who start detailing their W2s, hours, credit, time conflicts, etc. as part of an argument. It's almost as if they're trying to prove a bigger manly part.

Noted.......

Most junior ORD to for August is a 2/11/13 hire.

Thanks. Is ORD the smallest base for Spirit or is ACY?

Dude, just go back home under the VX bridge. I'm done feeding the troll. Sorry all, for the diversion.

I was in the March 4th class and a buddy got LAS and so did a few guys in the classes after us.

Guys, just ignore Shyguy

He made a strong push to get on with Spirit before landing at VX, I'm sure he had no problem with all of our "BS fees" back then. As I said earlier, it very clearly worked out for Spirit, our employees, and Shyguy that he was not offered employment here. Everyone wins Shy, congradulations, now just move along...

This is a small industry and I am not sure what he is attempting to gain by antagonizing posters on various threads, not only on APC but other forums as well. I have friends at VX and wish them the best! His particular attitude does not seem to represent the Attitude of the VX pilot group. I wish everyone at VX great success in the future... That being said, heaven forbid VX folds one day, it would be a real shame if MR Shyguy threw away a multi-million dollar career (at any airline he applies to) because of his constant antagonizing of colleagues on various message boards. On an anonymous web board, he has made it pretty clear to others who he is, and chances are someone, somewhere, on some interview board will be familiar with his constant condescending, antagonizing posts all over the web... APC is a great place to network, many posters here have taken the time to help and answer my questions, helping me get to where I am today. I just don't understand the motivation with this guy, but whatever.

Shy, I wish you and my friends at VX great success

(Apologies to grammar, typed on a less-than-smart phone)

Thanks for the LAS info !

I've cut out several forums because it isn't worth it. I'm in the process of cutting out from one more. You post very judgementally without knowing me, and you'd be wrong about me not helping others. I've helped several with VX, and got one hired so far (which is a very tough thing to do when HR runs the show). Have you browsed the VX threads? I do nothing but answer questions. If I don't know an answer, I go out of my way to find an answer and help people.

Good day.

You mad....bro.

^ ohhhhhhhh snaap. Beahahahaha, absolutely fantastic :)