N9373M

I guess you kept that one to yourselves at that time. IIRC it has something to do with the T-Tail.

Boredom, confidence, and complacency can bite you. Just an interesting parallel factoid - Mooney's are not approved for spins either - NOT that I'd have any knowledge of that.

JamesNoBrakes

I've done a lot of spins. Too many people think it's all about the rudder. Yes, yaw while stalled/stalling can get you into it, but the last thing you want to do is "slam" opposite rudder when you're starting to yaw in one direction (unless you want some awesome opposite spins and crazy attitudes). Get that AOA down, that's the most important part. Get out of the stalled condition. No, you don't want to enter a spin in the normal cat, and it's VERY difficult to do this unless you're intentionally trying to, but if by some crazy strange chance it does start to happen, just push the nose forward fast and get that AOA down.

Moe Rudda

Careful how you phrase this stuff no brakes, once spinning simply pushing the stick forward will only accelerate the spin. I think you are referring to much earlier, at the innitial stall. The best advice on these matters is to consult the good ole' POH.

PW305

Spins within CG are only recoverable if the pilot follows the correct recovery techniques!

Fluglehrer

MoeRudda,
I'm sure what JamesNoBrakes meant was to relax back pressure immediately as part of a "spin prevent" (as the USAF used to call it in the T-37). The T-37 would wrap up pretty quick if you tried the "spin prevent" when it was already established in the spin.
The main point is that you need stall + yaw to get into a spin. If you stop either immediately, before the spin is established, recovery happens quickly. Last month I did 22 "upset recovery" flights in our F33C aerobatic Bonanza, with slipping and skidding cross-controlled stalls each time. The plane recovers immediately if back pressure is relaxed and rudder/ailerons placed to neutral after the initial "snap". If back pressure is held, it can get interesting...

JamesNoBrakes

Yep, I was trying to answer the CFI that was stating "what if I'm doing stalls with my student and...". I was trying to say that with decent knowledge and skills, it should never get as far as a spin. Also, every plane does recover differently and I'm not sure if Moe Rudda has spun an airplane where the rudder is not effective at stopping spin rotation, as opposed to some aircraft that are designed with extremely effective rudders that get airflow easily in spins (basically the opposite of skycatchers, haha). Pushing the stick forward slowly does result in spin acceleration, but there is so much more to it all I also happen to see a lot of (unfortunately) people that attempt to make an aircraft spin "better" by employing a variety of techniques that are not IAC with the approved procedure. While some may be relatively harmless and only serve to help the aircraft into a spin, this general idea and operating method could be hazardous if you don't understand the effects or get an outcome that was unexpected. It's usually the crowd that doesn't really know what their doing but they "heard this works".

Used to fly those aerobatic bonanzas! How are the wing-spars holding up?

Fluglehrer

Not so well! Our wing carry-through spar has been patched twice now in the past year.
I just try to hum "Don't worry, be happy" as I walk out to fly our F33C...

Sonny Crockett

PLEASE READ THE ABOVE STATEMENT!

GO GET SOME TIME IN A PITTS and see what the "stick forward" will do for you in a spin.---NOT A GOOD THING!


-Former Spin instructor
Pitts/Eagle/Extra

PW305

Crossover to inverted?