Glasgow: alcohol. Again?
08-07-2019, 08:26 AM
#71
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2016
Posts: 69
Originally Posted by rickair7777
Too bad they can't just apply that to countries with stringent rules.
United’s policy is “zero tolerance” when operating - worldwide.
“Zero tolerance” is defined as a BAC less than .02. A pilot blowing .02 to .039 will be removed from duty by United - any where in the world.
08-07-2019, 08:56 AM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Position: Airbus 320 Captain
Posts: 481
Originally Posted by TheRaven
If you need an App or a portable breathalyzer to tell you if you’re drinking too much, you’re drinking too much. What are you gonna do, break out your phone and show them the App as they’re arresting you?
Its pretty simple to limit yourself to a couple beers with dinner, and nothing within 12 hrs of your show time. If you can’t enjoy an overnight without more alcohol, you might have a problem you should address before it becomes a much bigger problem.
Its pretty simple to limit yourself to a couple beers with dinner, and nothing within 12 hrs of your show time. If you can’t enjoy an overnight without more alcohol, you might have a problem you should address before it becomes a much bigger problem.
08-07-2019, 09:06 AM
#73
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,409
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
United’s policy is “zero tolerance” when operating - worldwide.
“Zero tolerance” is defined as a BAC less than .02. A pilot blowing .02 to .039 will be removed from duty by United - any where in the world.
“Zero tolerance” is defined as a BAC less than .02. A pilot blowing .02 to .039 will be removed from duty by United - any where in the world.
I was talking about the bottle-to-brief rule, ie don't really need 12 hours in the US, but maybe you do in scotland since they seem to practice pretty invasive monitoring.
08-07-2019, 02:54 PM
#74
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2016
Posts: 69
Originally Posted by rickair7777
That's true for all airlines in my experience.
I was talking about the bottle-to-brief rule, ie don't really need 12 hours in the US, but maybe you do in scotland since they seem to practice pretty invasive monitoring.
I was talking about the bottle-to-brief rule, ie don't really need 12 hours in the US, but maybe you do in scotland since they seem to practice pretty invasive monitoring.
Ah, I did not know that.
I think to keep it simple for our airline all crews, regardless of theater, should follow the same rule - 13.5 hours to scheduled departure time, or scheduled start time of a training event one must cease alcohol consumption.
Is it a diaper rule, sure, but we have many diaper rules. Is it more than legally required in most instances - yes. Might it save a pilot from stepping in his own fecal material, most likely. Is that something all of us should want to do, I’d like to think so.
I also think ALPA should hit this harder than they have been. (The letter from the ALPA legal advisor is a very good start.) I like a beer as much as the next guy, but we have got to do a better job of taking care of each other.
08-07-2019, 06:18 PM
#75
Get me outta here...
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: Boeing right seat
Posts: 1,541
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
I think to keep it simple for our airline all crews, regardless of theater, should follow the same rule - 13.5 hours to scheduled departure time, or scheduled start time of a training event one must cease alcohol consumption.
Is it a diaper rule, sure, but we have many diaper rules. Is it more than legally required in most instances - yes. Might it save a pilot from stepping in his own fecal material, most likely. Is that something all of us should want to do, I’d like to think so.
I also think ALPA should hit this harder than they have been. (The letter from the ALPA legal advisor is a very good start.) I like a beer as much as the next guy, but we have got to do a better job of taking care of each other.
Is it a diaper rule, sure, but we have many diaper rules. Is it more than legally required in most instances - yes. Might it save a pilot from stepping in his own fecal material, most likely. Is that something all of us should want to do, I’d like to think so.
I also think ALPA should hit this harder than they have been. (The letter from the ALPA legal advisor is a very good start.) I like a beer as much as the next guy, but we have got to do a better job of taking care of each other.
08-07-2019, 06:39 PM
#76
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Sleeping in the black swan’s nest.
Posts: 5,709
Originally Posted by MaxQ
Hoss,
I can't figure out if you don't believe them or just consider them idiots who made a poor career decision.
If it's the "I don't believe you" area, 2 stories.
It's 1991 (probably 1991 since that was when my second airline was looking, accurately, very bleak.) I was eavesdropping on a conversation in crew room. Guy had a choice...United or Southwest.
He chose Southwest. (remember, while Southwest looked great and was doing well, they were not yet the gorilla that was in their future.)
Second story: Me. I turned done United, but inadvertently! Interviewed 1992 and finished medical part in Dec. of 92. Got the you're in the pool letter shortly after. Spring of '93 S. Wolff announces hiring freeze. Fall 0f '93 unemployed again as furloughed during the break/up liquidation of airline #3.
Finally hired by airline 4 in March "94. That August (I think it was August), employee buyout at UAL has gone through, get a letter to reschedule a "touch base" interview as it had been over a year. Great!
OK...been at airline 4 less than a year. Friends had gone to bat for me to get me hired, so didn't want to jump ship without giving at least a year. Family member(s) have health problems....maybe things will be better later and I can be away for initial training later on with less worry and stress.
Solution? I figure call and see if can be put at bottom of pool and delay re-interview date. Speak with a friendly lady who assures me no problem....just write S. Stuckey a letter and all will be well.
I do so...dumb move. I get a letter back, nicely and politely worded, that basically says either you want to work here or you don't. Feel free to re-apply in a year.
Life goes on, had a 15.5 year run with airline 4 until they got shutdown. So not bad, just different than what might have been elsewise.
The point being, people do sometimes turn down United.....even if they didn't realize they were doing so at the time.
I can't figure out if you don't believe them or just consider them idiots who made a poor career decision.
If it's the "I don't believe you" area, 2 stories.
It's 1991 (probably 1991 since that was when my second airline was looking, accurately, very bleak.) I was eavesdropping on a conversation in crew room. Guy had a choice...United or Southwest.
He chose Southwest. (remember, while Southwest looked great and was doing well, they were not yet the gorilla that was in their future.)
Second story: Me. I turned done United, but inadvertently! Interviewed 1992 and finished medical part in Dec. of 92. Got the you're in the pool letter shortly after. Spring of '93 S. Wolff announces hiring freeze. Fall 0f '93 unemployed again as furloughed during the break/up liquidation of airline #3.
Finally hired by airline 4 in March "94. That August (I think it was August), employee buyout at UAL has gone through, get a letter to reschedule a "touch base" interview as it had been over a year. Great!
OK...been at airline 4 less than a year. Friends had gone to bat for me to get me hired, so didn't want to jump ship without giving at least a year. Family member(s) have health problems....maybe things will be better later and I can be away for initial training later on with less worry and stress.
Solution? I figure call and see if can be put at bottom of pool and delay re-interview date. Speak with a friendly lady who assures me no problem....just write S. Stuckey a letter and all will be well.
I do so...dumb move. I get a letter back, nicely and politely worded, that basically says either you want to work here or you don't. Feel free to re-apply in a year.
Life goes on, had a 15.5 year run with airline 4 until they got shutdown. So not bad, just different than what might have been elsewise.
The point being, people do sometimes turn down United.....even if they didn't realize they were doing so at the time.
1. Reading comprehension is an important life skill.
2. Get a grip dude...Seriously.
08-07-2019, 08:39 PM
#77
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,409
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
Ah, I did not know that.
I think to keep it simple for our airline all crews, regardless of theater, should follow the same rule - 13.5 hours to scheduled departure time, or scheduled start time of a training event one must cease alcohol consumption.
I think to keep it simple for our airline all crews, regardless of theater, should follow the same rule - 13.5 hours to scheduled departure time, or scheduled start time of a training event one must cease alcohol consumption.
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
Is it a diaper rule, sure, but we have many diaper rules. Is it more than legally required in most instances - yes. Might it save a pilot from stepping in his own fecal material, most likely. Is that something all of us should want to do, I’d like to think so.
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
I also think ALPA should hit this harder than they have been. (The letter from the ALPA legal advisor is a very good start.) I like a beer as much as the next guy, but we have got to do a better job of taking care of each other.
But yes, for sure take care of your partner(s).
08-07-2019, 09:17 PM
#78
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Position: A Nobody
Posts: 1,559
The change to the 12 hour rule really should not make any difference to the social habits required for this job. My observation is those who disagree with it and feel they can responsibly drink will just continue as they previously did.
Yes I was here when there was a 24 hour rule and many ignored that one in the day. But, as our ALPA lawyer said to me when the change was made, “24 hours is unreasonable and defending someone who violated the rule was not difficult. Now the 12 hour rule, that will take some work to defend a pilot who is caught in violation.”
What the change does is to protect United Airlines from being scrutinized further by the FAA and foreign governments. There’s far more financially at stake for the Corp if they simply do nothing.
Personally I think it is an easy rule to live with.
Yes I was here when there was a 24 hour rule and many ignored that one in the day. But, as our ALPA lawyer said to me when the change was made, “24 hours is unreasonable and defending someone who violated the rule was not difficult. Now the 12 hour rule, that will take some work to defend a pilot who is caught in violation.”
What the change does is to protect United Airlines from being scrutinized further by the FAA and foreign governments. There’s far more financially at stake for the Corp if they simply do nothing.
Personally I think it is an easy rule to live with.
08-08-2019, 12:26 AM
#79
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 848
Originally Posted by TOGA Thrust
I also think ALPA should hit this harder than they have been. (The letter from the ALPA legal advisor is a very good start.) I like a beer as much as the next guy, but we have got to do a better job of taking care of each other.
On a side note......don’t get $hit-faced at the hotel bar.........amateur.
08-08-2019, 07:39 AM
#80
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
Originally Posted by PhantomHawk
Nope.
On a side note......don’t get $hit-faced at the hotel bar.........amateur.
On a side note......don’t get $hit-faced at the hotel bar.........amateur.
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