No degree interviews!??!?
 

I'm just curious if anyone out there is hearing of people getting interviews without a degree? I'm currently working on it and should be done around March 2020 but just wondering with my Military experience if 1800TT, 400PIC in C-12, 200 in 121 world, and ATP could off-set the degree need. I think I know the answer, but I'm still going to ask.
Gracias,
-me

This was directly conveyed by the Sr. Pilot Hiring Manager at the recent career expo. She mentioned that college degree is not mandatory. They do hire non-degree holders. On the contrary 98% have degrees and 2% who get hired don't have one. So out of 600 pilots a year they hire, approximately 12 didn't had a degree.

Now, what qualifications those pilots have, is a different question.

And they probably came from a CPP program, so no degree no job at UAL.

With your sterling credentials, I suspect that they'll be sending a limo any day. :D





Sorry, I'm not trying to be a Richard but with your quals you do not qual when stacked up against the 5000 guys out there with a degree AND 5000 hours of 121 PIC time.

You'll definitely get here, but you will get here sooner with that piece of paper and significant, quality flight time. The lost decade produced a mess of highly qualified pilots. Many of them are still slurping at the aft-most teat in Wally World. They deserve a shot before you.

I am a mil C12 guy and was hired with the following stats:

3500 C12
1500 PC/IP/MP/IE/SP
20 PIC 135 king air
3.3 gpa BS degree
4.0 gpa MS degree

They do hire us prop guys, but you will need to beef up your resume most likely.

Army WOFT guy?

Finish the degree and go to regional and get some JET PIC. Eventually it will pay off...just a little short on the quals.

You could have a Master's degree and you wouldn't be competitive with that flight time. It's going to be tough landing anywhere other than a regional.

Yes, you can get an interview with that very impressive CV ... at the regionals.

As for the 2% that get hired without a degree mentioned earlier, I suspect that number's been rounded up considerably.

No, I know both.


JK. Get a degree.

Yes you can get hired at United without a degree but your chances are very slim. You would need a strong work history and community history to be hired without the degree.

Even a degree in left handed puppetry would be better than no degree.

Check Airman with extracurricular volunteer time on your resume but no degree? Apply.

Is that competitive?

You think 400PIC in a king air and an ATP is enough experience to offset the degree requirement?

You're 300 hours above the mins for the regionals. I'd be a little more realistic. Guys with 10k hours, 5k 121 PIC and good degrees aren't getting called.

I had a C-12 guy with 3000TT in my new hire class at Envoy. He's still here and probably going to flow before he gets called.

Nope........

Yet they’ve been hired at UA and Southwest to my knowledge in the past 12 months.

I know multiple individuals with less than 3000TT who were primarily Mil and less than 100hrs 121 who were still given CJO's at the big 3. So the idea that someone without 10,000TT and 5,000 PIC in 121 will never get hired is outdated. Besides, if someone had 10,000TT and 5,000 PIC 121 and cannot get a job at the majors means they have either F'd up somewhere in their career or are the kind of persons no one wants to fly with. I'd be self evaluating at that point.

Why anyone would go to SWA now is beyond me. To me, they're just a few tics above Spirit or Allegiant.

Times have changed.

Uh.. nope.

The low time .mil pilots are fighter/heavy guys who usually have masters degrees.

If I had a C note for every GREAT and qualified guy I knew who was passed over for an interview, I'd be sipping Pappy every night.

Lame comment. Not everyone wants to work here and those that do want to work here, not all of them will be hired. Maybe United, Delta, FEDEX never called? From all my friends that wanted United but never got the call or didn’t make it past our interview, they landed at SWA and seem to be pretty happy with a good paying job and lots of time at home. Yes it’s flying a guppy the rest of their career, but they seem to be more concerned with the good pay and schedule flexibility then the plane they fly.

Oohh. Sounds like the golden boy has it all!

Honestly, what did he say that was wrong? They are a few tics above Alligient and Spirit. They fly a small plane will little if any career options. Certainly they are happy to have a job, but like the 90's, I think the Big 3 plus Fed Ex and UPS have more to offer.

Seventeen years ago, the shoe was on a completely different foot.

SWA was THE place to be when the US econ was in the dump. Steady pay and growth....never mind that the rest of their contract had serious thin spots. Think of the BUCKS and quick upgrade!!!!

All the majors were laying off pilots and hacking away at the gonads of those who remained on the property. But back then there were airlines called USAirways, Northwest Airlines and Continental. Not to mention the second-tier carriers. The mofo's on the top floor had all the leverage. That dynamic has changed and changed for the better for ATP rated pilots in the US. Today a young buck has the option of flying domestically for life or flying domestically and / or seeing the world. Right seat wages are way up and should only improve with the next contract. Eggs are great, but they're not everything. Astonishingly, I have SWA buds who would love to have other opportunities.

And just for reference, "Golden boy" is in his 33rd year of airline flying and has friends working at just about every airline. He completely lucked into his job at UA and ate the big feces sandwich for 15 years after those Delta Hotels flew Boeings into buildings. "Golden Boy's" work-life for a long time wasn't so golden. He fully understands that there are many places to work offering many different career paths. I could be happy just about anywhere. All I am saying is that flying for Southwest, Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, etc would be my second choice were I job shopping today. My first choice would be to a global, US-based airline. Apply wherever you like. 30 plus years is a LONG time and there are other planes than the 737. If you're taller than 6 feet, most of them are more comfortable. You're going to sit in it 1000 hours per year for a long time. Your back will thank you.

When you say 98% have a degree does this mean 4 year degree or better? The reason I ask is I have an Associates degree( 2 yr degree), so technically I am not in the non-degree holder category, or would I be? If not do you happen to know what percent had just a 2 year degree? Does a two year degree help at all and if not does anyone see that changing in the next couple of years?

While on this subject let me state my Creds to see if I am competitive at all..

Current Line check Airmen at 121 regional, 4500 TT and just hit 1000 TPIC, with 2 year degree, thanks for the info.

You currently possess all the creds you need to be a decent airline pilot (provided you’re not a tool! ;). Two more years of school won’t make a better pilot. But it will probably make your phone ring sooner.

Sucks for you but that’s how the game is rigged. Some of the best guys I have flown with had zero or minimal colleg. And some of the scariest had degrees from very impressive colleges and institutions.

That’s simply my uneducated opinion. But, there are a ton of reasons for you to finish it. Enroll online, that might grease your app a bit.

The 98% have a four year degree.

As long as United has plentiful applications on file with degrees I doubt that will change. It could certainly change in the future, however, but you will have missed a huge hiring wave in the interim.

The major airlines have been requiring (at least in practice) degrees before you started flying so if this is a shock I don't know what to tell you.

Two more years of colleg will teach him spelling (and punctuation ;) though....

If you don't have a degree do not have any expectation of getting hired.

So 98% of the pilots hired have a 4 year. That in itself doesn't mean anything without knowing what percentage of the applicants have a 4 year. I've heard (but not seen proof) over 95% have a 4 year, making it at most twice as hard to get hired, and possibly just as hard, or even easier if 99% have one. Hard to say without the data

It’s like fishing size restrictions. They are going to throw back anything that bites that is under a certain size. If you are a fish that wants to get caught and kept, deliberately taking yourself out of the keeper category isn’t a smart move. If you choose not to meet their requirements, expect to be thrown back. You may not like it, but those are the current rules of the sea.

This question routinely comes up. Yes, we do hire without it. Yes, the folks without the degree are highly qualified in other areas. (High total time, excess type ratings, evaluator pilot, management experience, former military, all of the above.)

But you're not competitive for getting the invite without it. Just keep plugging away until you're finished, knowing that chances are your phone won't ring until you update with the degree.

It could very well be, but my point was just about the math. 95% of the pilots that get hired at the legacies are white males, yet there is a lot of white males at the regionals complaining how much easier it is to get hired as a minority/female. Just because 95% of the people that get hired are white males doesn't mean it is easier to get hired as a white male, you need to know the percentage of applicants vs percentage of hired to answer the question if a degree is required.
(it probably is, just don't like sloppy math)

I am in the minority, and count myself fortunate. Interviewed 10/24 and received the CJO on 11/1. My stats:

8400 TT
7900 Jet
2300 PIC
12 years at a regional
Line Check Pilot

Several jobs prior to the airline with management/supervisory experience, but 2 classes shy of a college degree before my school closed.

My best guess is that the combination of LCP and other prior management positions is enough to satisfy their degree requirement.

Still waiting on a class date....

A college degree was still required through the CPP. Many otherwise-qualified pilots were turned down for that reason.

if you had 120 or more credit hours they likely gave you credit for degree. congrats

Not all were turned down. Some were given a CJO provided that they finish their degree within a specified period of time. We are not near the point where the degree doesn’t matter. Getting hired without one makes one the exception to the rule. We’ve all known how the legacies view a degree. Not having one is a choice that is made, one that will have an extremely negative impact on the odds of gaining employment at a legacy. We’ve all known that this hiring wave was coming, yet some still decided not to check the boxes that they want to see checked. A degree doesn’t make you a better pilot, but without one you will watch others move on while you toil away at the regional level.

Hope it wasn't Trump University!! Congrats. :D

Or Burlington College, bankrupt and gone. Run by Bernie’s wife. If only it had been free...

That’s basically what they told the Aviate candidates a degree isn’t required but if you don’t have one you need to have some serious leadership management titles on your resume to make up for it.