Airline Pilot Central Forums - Agreement in Principle

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Quote:

Originally Posted by CALFO (Post 3128038)

Even if Covid goes away after two years that doesn't mean that our customers are coming back. Most analysts think that the number of airline passengers, in particular business travelers, will remain depressed for several years. Our airline has a choice:

Option 1. We can reduce overall size through mass furloughs and aircraft retirements. I'm fairly certian that once 3,000 plus pilots leave the property the company will begin quickly retire the majority of the 320's and 777's. Once demand returns, we will then have to decide if it's safe to grow the airline and bring back furloughs. If business travel is still depressed and yields are low it won't be worth it to grow. In the meantime, we will watch start-ups enter our hubs and our market share just like Jetble and Virgin America in the previous downturns.

Option 2. We can keep our pilots in their seats and keep our planes in storage. When there is a demand surge, we can pounce on it and grab market share. We can even go after the low-yield flying and the cost to carry it is negligible given that the company is paying pilots not to work.

Of the two options, only one presents a future airline with opportunities for pilots.

Does it make sense to keep lots of pilots on the sidelines for a fast recovery when it really takes that long for demand to recover?

this TA strikes me as inefficient for the company and potentially for many pilots. Do you really want a part time job for years to come - on reserve?

Not trying to argue with you guys or split hairs, but I wish you all would stop characterizing Kirby as a gambler. He’s not a gambler, he’s a CHEATER, and the two are as different as the sun and the moon.

Kirby doesn’t belly up to the table unless he is sure he is gonna win. Doesn’t that tell you everything you need to know about this TA?

It’s really amazing to me that there are so many pilots on this forum that get paid very well to make informed decisions based on actual information, not rumors of what might be true. Snap judgements can kill you in this profession. Yet many are saying automatic “no” or “yes” without reading one word or having looked at the TA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DashTrash (Post 3128085)

100% this. Devil is in the details. Even if the rumors are correct, what does "reserve improvements" mean? That could mean anything from elimination of airport ready and short call to "you get an extra 10 minutes of callout time". And that's only one of the rumored items...

Quote:

Originally Posted by TFAYD (Post 3128080)

You’re trying to tell me potentially making around $70K to sit 9 days reserve a month sounds bad? Really?

Quote:

Originally Posted by TFAYD (Post 3128080)

Does it make sense to keep lots of pilots on the sidelines for a fast recovery when it really takes that long for demand to recover?

That's one of the first things I'll be looking for in the TA. I'm hoping to see something in the 1.5 to 2.0 year range. Provided there is a vaccine by year's end that is distributed throughout 2021 then getting us to 2022 should work. If it's only six months then I'm not sure I see the point in it.

Quote:

this TA strikes me as inefficient for the company and potentially for many pilots. Do you really want a part time job for years to come - on reserve?

Nope. I wouldn't expect this TA to be in effect beyond May of 2022. What I like about the concept of us keeping everyone on the property and in-seat, aside from the obvious of keeping the junior pilots employed, is that it allows us to take advantage of whatever opportunities may present themselves. What I don't want to see is the airline go into extreme reduction mode. That is a very difficult hole to dig out of. Legacy UAL is the perfect example, once UAL began mass furloughs and fleet reductions they never recovered to anywhere near their original size.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DashTrash (Post 3128085)

Maybe one of the reasons we as professional pilots have a very poor track record of success in negotiations in extremis is because we are machinery operators and energy state managers not highly experienced long term planners, financial analysts or negotiators. Let's be very careful about correlating operating a complex airplane with financial analysis and contract negotiations... This could turn out as amazing as that awesome 4th marriage we thought was sure to work out finally this time :D

Screwed by the top third, middle third, or lower third, or any combination of them, or all of them. Screwed by Kirby. Screwed by the MEC. And on and on it goes with some people.....ad nauseum. Just wait for the TA (and actually read it) and then vote your conscience. But try to lose the constant paranoia that EVERYONE is out to get you ALL of the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by N6279P (Post 3128089)

You’re trying to tell me potentially making around $70K to sit 9 days reserve a month sounds bad? Really?

PAID for by the top 2/3 of the seniority list. That's one lucrative jobs program.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poss (Post 3128103)

PAID for by the top 2/3 of the seniority list. That's one lucrative jobs program.

Most of the country has seen income and job loss. Our senior people should be exempt from that?