read the manual buddy it’s right there! It’s not a mystery.....it’s in the NORMALS section. Go ahead have me replaced because you can’t be bothered to read the NORMALS section.

When you step into a 787 I will teach you what a GLS is since most haven’t flown an airplane that can do them. But when you come back for CQ I expect you to know it, or do you want me to teach you what an ILS is too? Or is that Varsity knowledge?

So... if you find yourself going into EWR one night down to mins and the GLS is your only option because (make up and reason), you're going to do what?

If it's in the FM you're expected to know it. Maybe not verbatim, but at least the broad strokes. "GLS in use? Lets review that real quick." You're the guy that would look right and say "what the hell is that and how do we do it?" Being the Captain means being in command of and having a full understanding of your vessel. Diverting because you're lazy isn't the right answer. The Captain whose book knowledge exceeds mine are the ones I respect and emulate. Guys with attitudes like yours are the ones I know I have to baby sit. I'd love, LOVE to hear that conversation after you have your FO or an IP replaced because of their "unrealistic line oriented" view.

Wrong. We’d brief it up using the brown book. You seem to miss the point BIG TIME. The issues arose from the comment “we’d have a problem”. No we wouldn’t, simply because I didn’t memorize a procedure that is rarely flown on the line. I’d look it up, just like in the real world. And if that didn’t satisfy the PI, well then we’d either have to review it and move on, or we find someone who will. Simple! If it was time sensitive, it WOULD be a memory item. Y’all are creating straw man arguments that have no merit. People sometimes forget that TK is there for us, not the other way around.

ps—your argument falls apart when you make ridiculous statements about what I would or wouldn’t do. Suffice it to say, you’re out to lunch.

The torpedo sinking of the SS Friends Of Fred scab ship was a close second.

Just a heads up but the Approach briefing guide is now on the iPad... Just sayin.

Thx, Hoss. I’m aware. It was a general statement about looking things up. Something MOP seems to think is “a problem”

i never said looking it up was a problem. Go back and read what I originally wrote.

there is never anything wrong with looking something up as long as it doesn’t take you 5 minutes to do it.

tk is there for you. But there is also an expectation that you know the basics. I only have 4 hrs to get you ready for a validation on CQ. There’s atleast 2 hours of material I must cover maybe more, plus questions. TK is here for you to a point but TK will also not hesitate to sign you up for more training if you need it.

GLS used to really be a pushed option in the ATIS at IAH. All of our 737s aren’t capable but used to ask for it for a few years when we had the option. In all aspects, just an ILS as far as flying it. Not difficult. Saw a number of anomalies during day VFR that required intervention so not really a fan. RNAV RNP and one day auto land from it will really be where we are headed IMO. I personally love the RNPs from downwind IAF. Quiet on the radio and the 737 flies them well.

there’s a reason that the new “oral” has specific topics listed in it. Why? Because back in the day, scab check airmen and over zealous PI’s had their pet subjects, and if an answer wasn’t quickly produced to their satisfaction, they would down a guy. ALPA got involved and purged these D bags from TK, but some of the rationale on this thread is exactly the same crap they would spew. Here’s a hint: GLS’s are rare, regardless of whether or not it’s in the book. We have bold items and QRC items for a reason. So guys can’t get on a soap box and look down their noses at line guys who don’t memorize the stuff. My point’s been made. Time to put to is to bed, fellers.

point well made.....it’s not my job to know what’s in the manual....it’s the PIs job to teach it to you every 9 months.

good point I’ll take that to my next event. Santa Clause is right here for you.

may e that’s why people in this thread think training sucks.......

agreed on all points.....I love flying RNP approaches request them whenever available.

Lee- agree and correct on all points. Especially the rnp. Regardless of how many times people try to misrepresent my position, I know what I know, what I have to know, what I should know, and most importantly—what I don’t know. All the rhetoric about wanting spoon fed, Santa etc is just the ramblings of people who know they’re wrong.

You know what you don’t know? Brown book? What’s a GLS? You sound like the guy who needs to be spoon fed. Replace the PI? You will definitely get a new PI... After you fail.

Nice tie.....

no kidding. The trolls are out today.

shouldn’t you be studying what you know you don’t know?

Cute. It seems all you have left is smart ass comments and trolling. As for me, I’d say anything I’ve said here at TK. I GUARANTEE you wouldn’t talk to me like this at TK. I guess that’s the greatness of web forums, huh?

Iv told plenty of pilots that they need to open a book and study. If your book knowledge is weak I will be the first to tell you, that’s my job. I’m not here to give you a participation trophy I’m here to make sure my family is safe on your plane. If that hurts your feelings then so be it.

more straw man nonsense. Time to put the shovel down MOP.

im not sure that means what you think it means.

Funny. I guess your “I’m a tk smart guy” mentality extends to the rest of your life as well. I’d explain what it means, but seeing as you love book work so much, I’ll let you do your own homework. This is growing tiresome. I’ve haven’t heard much in the way of logic in several posts. Just schoolyard nonsense. You can have the last word, but your attempts to paint me as something I’m not are simply bogus and BS. The issue started when you got on your high horse and said we’d have “a problem” if you couldn’t recite a procedure that is so rare that many have NEVER done it. That’s it. Period. End of story. All the other insults were just a poor attempt to muddy the water. Like I said, my training record speaks for itself. Bringing up the “I want my family safe on your jet” card? Pathetic. So I can’t quote the book re a non memory item, and suddenly your family isn’t safe. Dude- you don’t have any idea what the hell you're talking about.

Nice legacy wings. You gents are out of touch. The days of stump the dummy are gone. We(line pilots) are the customers at TK. I haven’t had an experience there where I didn’t feel like I was the customer. Yeah, it’s the PI’s job to train you but surprise there are objective performance standards. If you haven’t looked at a manual since the pre iPad days and still think you are standard/average you probably don’t meet those standards. Above all, I expect TK to turn out pilots that I feel will take care of my family sitting in the back. So far, all I hear is old man Guppy 95 Beating his chest that he doesn’t need to study and that TK better take care of him or he’ll remove the PI. He sounds like a terrible pilot. TK will make sure he gets all the retraining he needs so that he goes back to the line a safe pilot, as they should. The ALPA pin that I wear proudly, means to me that United pilots support each other. Doesn’t having a culture of safety ultimately support United pilots? I think we need to raise the bar a bit.

Total tool. Once again, complete bs mischaracterization. .

I've seen guys crash 3 SE approaches in a row and still pass. Seen another just as bad. They still pass.

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Then you come fly the line and we baby sit.

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yeah that can happen. We can’t just fail someone without them hitting certain gates, that is because of AQP. Iv seen crews that needed to be downed but they didn’t hit that final threshold. The debrief was where I let them know that what I saw was unacceptable and then sent them on their way.

somtimes.....I usually take pride in NOT being that guy but it happens sometimes. Last trip I totally **** the bed....mostly because I was in an airport that I don’t fly out of much and my SA was just not quite there. Thanks to the CA for getting me straightened out on day one. Day 2 was much better, except for the landing :rolleyes:. Realized afterward that it was my first night landing in a while, flared too high.

What in the everliving F did I just read. If you personally don't believe a crew is qualified then you 100% have the ability to not pass them. Please tell me you are joking.

Nope,

It depends on the event. AQP generally keeps moving a weak student through the training until they hit a hard stop with a failed validation. After a failed validation they get additional training.

Dork.:D

I love hand flying visuals. Everything else is just work.

lol.....I love hand flying good visuals like the expressway and the river.

Which is why I’d take the Airbus over the 737 every day of the week, and twice on Sunday! 😜

My sentiments exactly. Watching an autopilot do an RNP into DEN or IAH on a CAVU day is just about as boring as it gets.

There are those who like this post, and those who will.

Funny. I've been a narrow body guy for over 13 years and can count on one hand the number of FA issues I've encountered prior to this Fall. Since then? Well, lets say a few more than that. In common? All former international FAs "forced" to fly domestic trips now after many many many years of not doing so.

Maybe a generality or maybe after so many years I have a different take on what I normally consider drama vs. this new drama I'm seeing. As for passengers? Yes, I agree. The number of those issues has gone way up, but our FAs have always seemed to get it handled.

Perhaps drama was the wrong word. How about hassle? On the WB, there are just 2 legs per trip, 2 briefings, things seem to run more reliably, and fewer days on the road. On the NB you have to deal with 2-3 (sometimes more) legs per day, crew changes, briefings, better chance of delays bouncing through the hubs for 3-4 days........ Being on a WB is definitely a slower pace, more relaxed, and far more productive. For only $40k difference in pay, I’ll take my time in the bunk, pass on all of the extra work, and end up home an extra 50-60 days per year. Again, it’s great to have a choice as to what kind of flying that you want to do.

I’ve done both, and IMO the variable that is so difficult to quantify if the toll that a steady diet of WB flying takes on one’s body. Constant circadian rhythm disruptions aren’t healthy. I think how well one can rest in a bunk, adapt on a layover, and get reaclimated are factors involved in choosing the type of flying one does. Throw in long layovers where it can be easy to overeat and drink if you’re not careful, and it’s a recipe for poor health. I envy guys who can do it without feeling whipped at the end of a trip half way around the world.

I’m one of those people who actually feel better flying WB, but I don’t act like most WB pilots. I sleep like a rock in the bunk, and I’m not much fun on a layover. I take a good nap when I get to the hotel, get some exercise, have a healthy meal, don’t drink alcohol, and then back to sleep. On go home day, I have a nice breakfast, sleep well in the bunk, and get home that night. I’m usually pretty tired, but I just go to bed, get a good night sleep, and feel fine the next day. Domestic is harder for me. Irregular hours, short layovers, delays, weather, extra workload, and still commute. The best thing that I’ve found for my health is the last 8 months of staying home. Eventually going back to work is going to be an adjustment.

out of curiosity, do you you use melatonin or any other natural sleep aid while on layovers? I never did, but maybe that’s something I should have tried. Even when I did as you mentioned(exercise, eat well, no alcohol etc) I just had a tough time falling asleep in Europe when it was the middle of the day to my body.