Lol, could someone who is more computer savvy (just about everyone) post the snapshot - assuming not a breach of confidentiality?

The junior NYC 777 FO is 4/11/2006. The junior NYC 757 FO is a UAL recall N67xx.

Can you pick up my dry cleaning and get the oil changed in my car? Just kidding...thanks for posting.

No worries, lol. I had to go back and cross reference the names with the seniority list. Junior IAH 737 CA is 6/05/2001 and EWR 737 CA is a '99 hire.

I found the PDF on UAL board...thanks.

I don't know how valuable the DOH of the junior pilots on any LCAL equipment is ... they are on reserve. And with LCAL's current contract, reserve at LCAL sounds like complete abuse of pilots from what I've read. Worse than most regional carriers.

....And the Junior Pilots (presently working/on property) at L-UA are NOT on reserve???

Your Point??

(The lighter.....As far as the current CBA/reserve rules being a POS, that I understand)

It is what you make of it, to a degree.

What is CAL's policy on reserve in this situation....you are going into 4 days off and get home on the first day..can they reassign you on day 2 for a trip or once you are gone you are on your days off...I keep hearing of them being able to move days off around.

There's a vast difference between LCAL reserve and reserve at other carriers. Even Mesa sounds more humane than LCAL's reserve policies.

We all know that you have two choices as to how you 'spend' your seniority. Either senior on an airframe that pays less money or junior (ask reserve) on an airframe that pays more money.
Reserve goes junior to lineholders because it's not as desirable. LCAL's contract moves the gap between reserve and lineholder to a completely different level.
Simply put, other than the junior entry position, 737 FO, comparing a junior LCAL pilot with a junior pilot at other airlines is apples to oranges.

Huge difference in reserve quality of life between 73, 757 and 777. 737 is horrific not so much on the 757 and the 777 folks never fly. It's the lack of staffing and difference in how CAL covers the entire 737 system with reserves not necessarily a base specific.

Section 25, Part 14, Para B:

Open time within BES will be assigned in the following order:
1. To a Lineholder who is on Company Business Available status.
2. To a Lineholder on RX duty status.
3. To a Lineholder on RA duty status.
4. To an available Reserve.
5. In seniority order to available Lineholders who have indicated that they desire
to be Junior Manned.
6. Junior assigned to a Lineholder in reverse order of seniority (Junior Manning). Junior Manning will be implemented for open Trip coverage only when priorities 1 through 5 have been exhausted, or within three (3) hours of scheduled departure time. A Lineholder who will be required to drop a Trip Pairing which would generate an additional Junior Manning requirement will be bypassed in the first attempt at coverage. Crew Scheduling, when notifying a pilot of such an assignment will clearly state that he is being Junior Manned. All assignments made under the provisions of this Paragraph will be fully documented by Crew Scheduling and forwarded to the System Chief Pilot within twenty-four (24) hours, with an information copy to the affected pilot, the Association, and his Base Chief Pilot within forty-eight (48) hours.
7. After the above steps have been exhausted, a pilot may be used in a lower Status.

My understanding is that due to LCAL manning, it doesn't take much to hit item 7.

If you say so. However, #367 on LCAL's seniority list just moved from a 787 CA slot to a 737 CA slot. He traded his seniority to be #2 in his base on the 737.

#2 in his base will not be sitting reserve. I guess he might choose to once but not again after that experience.

When talking reserve quality of life, 737 is the absolute lowest, period, nothing else is close. I have already said I don't care if this means I will never upgrade, but I will never sit reserve on the 737 the way its structured now. Off reserve is a different story.

Its a fact when it comes to reserves QOL and different equipment, The beauty of movement...you can have choices, QOL, money or both....not sure what his reasons may have been but the seniority system worked.

Beeker, he went from ~80% on the 787 to #2 on the 737.

Do you understand that person in question is only staffed on the B787 "on paper"??

His actual/present position is 82% on the B777 in EWR. Bidding DEN puts that same person at 5% on the B737. If that move means not having to commute, and sitting #2 in base, to each their own. 'Some' weigh QOL in different aspects, and NOT having to commute while sitting 'senior' in base may be his zin.

In the end, this is JUST a SnapShot, it's far from being set in stone. Don't know how L-UA did biz, but if this is your first rodeo with CAL's SnapShots, things will NO DOUBT be fluid till the Monet is published on the official closing.

Sit tight.

Monet, now that got a good laugh out of me!

I notice this has been popping up as bizarre on a few boards. Let's see big plane with commute or small plane with no commute? Hmm I'd gladly take a pay hit rather then commute out of Denver. Ual has the same situation with the SEA base. QOL to me means no commuting.

This might not be pertinint to the subject but WHAT is vthe Stencil that's applied to the CAL 757 below the N Number "operated by CALA014"?? And why is it being Applies to 8194?? Continental doesn't even FLY 747-422's So is this a Statement or a mistake?? So Who IS going to fly those Military Charters and shouldn't they bring back furloghed UAL crews to fly that airplane?? The Guys called Me about the Decal. Do you guys have ALPA Locals??

You're referencing the Airline Operating Certificate, CALA014A. The Continental certificate is the certificate of the combined airline. The United certificate was inferior, just like those ratted out airplanes you turn wrenches on. I kid I kid. But seriously, that's what you're seeing. :-)

The United certificate was written in the 40s and had legal jargon from that time frame. The CAL certificate was redone in the 80s during bankruptcy. The requirements were much less onerous and that is why the CAL certificate was used.

Not to mention the fact that CAL spent 3+ yrs devoted to developing, training, proving, and checking the crews for the RNAV/RNP approach criteria. Getting the .3 minimums was one thing (as SWA has now), then having the FAA sign-off on the .15 was a LONG time of paper/approval by the FAA.

Vacating the CAL Ops Cert would have null/voided the approval that CAL had received from the FAA in which to exercise those approaches/minimums. Going to the UA Ops Cert would have forced the Merged Flt Ops into having to repeat the entire certification process under L-UA's Ops Cert. With this being a big player in approaches that CAL trained for (as evidence of last years MV/LOE), it's something they were/are very serious in using from this point forward.

The FAA was playing the "No Waivers, No Favors" on that topic.
(Source: Capt E.C. B756 Flt Mgr.)

I have a hard time wrapping it up in RNAV/RNP approaches. It was strickley a cost item or in merger jargon "Best Practices". Cheaper to do the CAL cert than the UAL cert. (Source: ME ).

My condolences on your inability to wrap your head around this. Allow me to give you another example of how an operating certificate can force training costs etc. to rise. UAL did not conduct monitored low visibility approaches. As all approaches at both CAL and UAL below CAT I minimums require an autoland, it made sense to adopt the UAL non-monitored approach for low visibility approaches(no need to transfer controls when the airplane was going to autoland anyway). The FAA said "whoa CAL, not that easy, you must train all pilots on the non-monitored low visibility approach procedure to comply and allow this to be conducted on your certificate". The result, all our pilots are either in the process(757/767/777 beginning Jan 1, 2012) or will be commencing training on non monitored low visibility approaches and this training will go well into 2013 before CAL crews can perform low visibility approaches the way UAL crews do.

Non-precision approaches will be trained at UAL as the equipment is brought up to CAL standards so that we can conduct RNAV/RNP approaches down to the minimums already fought hard for by CAL over the last decade(.12 737NG/.15 756/.11? 777). Using the UAL certificate, as mature as it was, would be more difficult to alter thus requiring many years of proving runs etc. for RNAV(RNP) and even certain ETOPS procedures native to CAL.

Source,
ME

Coming from you......MUST be infallible :rolleyes:

Silly me.

Contrail67, with all due respect to Andy, the part of the contract he referenced really has nothing to do with the question you asked.

You asked about reserve. Under the L-CAL contract, we have MOVABLE and IMMOVABLE days when on reserve (generally 4 movable and 8 immovable if available the entire month). Your movable days can be "rolled" to later at the discretion of the company per operational necessity (which basically has no definition and means whenever they want to).

Essentially there are two different times to worry about under the L-CAL contract: 1500 and 1800. A reserve must check his schedule each day after 1500 to find out what the company is doing to you the next day (new call block, trip, etc.). A reserve is generally going to be released at 1800 on the day before a day off.

If you finish a trip prior to 1500, you must check your schedule to determine what they want you to do the next day. If you are going into MOVABLE days off and the company has not changed your schedule or rolled your days, you are automatically released to your next duty period (in this case your next set of reserve days). You do not have to recheck after 1500.

If you finish after 1500, check your schedule. If you finish after 1800, a reserve going into movable days off still has to check his schedule to make sure they haven't rolled your days or given you a trip. A reserve going into IMMOVABLE days off who finishes his trip after 1800 does not need to check his schedule.

Under your circumstances, if you are already in the middle of days off (day #2 of 4 you said above), you are not obligated to the company and they cannot touch you regardless of movable or immovable days. Technically there is not liability on your part to the company and they have no means of contacting you (i.e. a call block). DON'T ANSWER YOUR PHONE FROM SCHEDULING or at all. Screen your calls.

Do you really think the choice of Operating Certificates was due solely on the merit of approach mins. Ever wonder why the company gave you jelly beans instead of golden eggs. Hint : golden eggs cost more!


Choosing either certificate would generate training on one side or the other. Like I said "Best Practices" meaning cheaper to do the CAL cert than the UAL cert. nothing to do will quality. Sorry!

(Source: ME ).

Thank you...exactly what I was looking for. So the movable days off are notated on the schedule somehow?

EWR,

THANKS! Excellent post on reserve days.

With the 1500 and 1800 times, are they local domicile, IAH, or UTC?

SP

On a reserve's schedule "off" days are movable and "ioff" are immovable.

Local base time.

Thanks!

SP

EWRflyr, thanks for the clarification.

One of the LUAL furloughees stated that he got called in the middle of his days off and answered the phone. He was told that he was obligated to take the assignment but told them that was unable to be in position in such a short timeframe. He had to speak to someone on the matter after the fact - the agreed upon workaround was to not answer the phone.
While not answering the phone is a solution, it shouldn't matter if you answer the phone and turn down an assignment while on days off.

Perhaps I have some details incorrect (likely, especially with second/third hand information) but it sounded like if they talk to you on your days off, you can be forced to accept an assignment.

Andy, can't be forced on your days off, unless you are not thinking and want to be JM. Unfortunately, we have a few of them. Not saying, this was the case but...child care, can't get there, on the boat in the gulf, fatigue, too much buds etc...bottom line, you have to verbally accept the assignment, regardless of veiled threats to call the CPO. Even if they place it On your line, its not official unless you verbally accept. Some schedulers wiil attempt...call your CP. On the 1 or 2 times, i didnt pay attention to my phone, My response has been, he knows my number and will contact if he thinks its an issue. Have never had one call me. Shouldn't be this way, so get a phone screener or ring tone etc....to eliminate the stress. All this moveable/ immovable and involuntary JM must go . Your day off is exactly that and the pilot should control it...not scheduling.

He definitely didn't want JM; he's told them at least once that he was fatigued ... did the 6 day, park his butt for a day international, and then back for a few more days. When that was done, they tried to add another turn. He called 'no mas'.

As for being called on his days off, he was out of position (at home). I don't know who he spoke to after, perhaps a scheduling muckety muck. He was also threatened with the chief pilot carpet dance by the scheduler who initially called him.

Why not put the CP in speed dial, and when scheduling calls to "force" you into a trip, bring the CP into the call and explain to both of them that you're on days off and not available. Seems like an efficient way to kill two birds with one phone call.

One word: "Unavailabe". No further explanation/stories required. They can (and probably will) call the CPO all they like and the CP may or may not call you. It doesn't matter; you were "unavailable".

Fair enough.

But, this is also one of those "culture shock" issues for ex-UA guys at L-CAL where crew scheduling can't touch you at all on days off (except for the last day before RSV days to notify of an assignment) or move days off (domestically.)

I can only hope the L-UAL contract carries over into the JCBA in this instance.

Here are some known numbers from scheduling. Name them all "Scheduling" on your phone and don't answer unless you want to enter CAL's kafkaesque world of should-you-shouldn't-you be free from duty on your days off. 8003382739, 7133249728, 7133247013, 7133247051, 7133247019, 7133245000.

But since they've also been known to use their own cell phones, don't answer phone if you don't recognize the caller ID.

Sure, you can answer the phone and you can say no to an assignment and you can talk to you CP and, and, and, but if you just want to avoid the drama, don't answer.

There is an agreement (maybe it was a grievance) that you cannot be junior manned if you initiate the call. For example, you call to trade a trip for next week. They try to junior man you for tomorrow "while I've got you on the phone." Not allowed.

Sounds like the "Outsourcing Crew Scheduling to India" prophecy came true!

I understand that there are workarounds. But do you think that not answering your personal phone should be a workaround?