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-   -   Seniority snapshot (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/united/73469-seniority-snapshot.html)

6blade 03-13-2013 01:33 PM


Originally Posted by ChrisJT6 (Post 1371263)
Look for proof to be presented to the arbitrators of the real driver of the excessively rapid parking of the 737s and who filled the void. But then, who knows what they'll accept and folks may be able to capitalize on the temporary misfortune of 1436 UAL junior pilots which caused a temporary skewed entire UAL seniority list.

What??? All airlines were sucking hind teet in June of 2008, UALs answer to the economic crunch and fuel spikes were to park the old 737s... and the void was filled by RJs... Not CAL.

Think the SEC and Federal Government would have a hay day if there was ever some little hint that in 2008 the merger was in progress and it was CAL who benefited and the demise of UAL employees.... Insider trading, racketeering, collusion....???

Don't forget that CAL right sized for the merger too... at the same time we sold the majority of out 737-500s and parked and sold the 737-300 too ???? Come on!!!!:confused:

CaptainBigWood 03-13-2013 02:22 PM

This thread reads just about like USAirways vs. America West only with different names. Aren't you glad the union has such a clear consistent merger policy?

SpecialTracking 03-13-2013 02:37 PM


Originally Posted by CaptainBigWood (Post 1371309)
This thread reads just about like USAirways vs. America West only with different names. Aren't you glad the union has such a clear consistent merger policy?

All so ALPA can say, "we didn't do it to you, the arbitrators did."

ChrisJT6 03-13-2013 03:13 PM


Originally Posted by 6blade (Post 1371282)
What??? All airlines were sucking hind teet in June of 2008, UALs answer to the economic crunch and fuel spikes were to park the old 737s... and the void was filled by RJs... Not CAL.

Think the SEC and Federal Government would have a hay day if there was ever some little hint that in 2008 the merger was in progress and it was CAL who benefited and the demise of UAL employees.... Insider trading, racketeering, collusion....???

Don't forget that CAL right sized for the merger too... at the same time we sold the majority of out 737-500s and parked and sold the 737-300 too ???? Come on!!!!:confused:

First, RJs were almost maxed and only barely increases to the max allowed by contract. Plenty of MD80s and classic jets still operating today...It must have been magic the WB fleets kept pushing full after CAL entered the code share/star alliance simultaneously w UAL parking twice as many NB aircraft as CAL. Pretty sure there was a giant clue of a hint of merger between CAL and UAL in 2008. Plenty of press releases about sharing merger related info all the way back to Kellner. Go back and read the massive amount of threads on this forum about why CAL pilots didn't want to merge with UAL...2007 on. Doesn't really matter what our recollection of events are...he sat at the table and has proof of what really went down and we shall see how it is handled. The arbitrators had similar almost as hard of evidence in the NWA/DAL case too but disregarded it (see previous post with Arbitrators quote).

gofastmopar 03-13-2013 06:20 PM


Originally Posted by untied (Post 1369450)
I've read it.

I'm counting on the 3 listed parts of the merger policy to carry the most weight.

You're counting on something that is not mentioned, but in your mind makes perfect sense.

When lawyers get involved with the arbitrators, I would expect what is actually written down to carry the most weight.

Hopefully they'll bring up the CAL pilot who was involved with the USAir merger. He was pushing for DOH. We'll see if he had suddenly changed his mind now that HIS company is involved in a merger!:D

We'll see who's right in the end. A lot may be determined by "back room" deals involving certain pilots selling out others...

I happen to know the gentleman and to my knowledge has was in no way advocating DOH. It was the UsAirways East leadership that was stuck on that tangent and it hurt them...

untied 03-14-2013 07:46 AM


Originally Posted by gofastmopar (Post 1371489)
I happen to know the gentleman and to my knowledge has was in no way advocating DOH. It was the UsAirways East leadership that was stuck on that tangent and it hurt them...

There is a written opinion by him advocating the importance of DOH in the SLI.

Sunvox 03-15-2013 03:13 PM


Originally Posted by LCAL dude (Post 1369335)
Exactly. That Aug '99 LUAL pilot may have 8 years active service and 13 years longevity, but they're still furloughed, and if they were recalled tomorrow they'd be a junior-junior 'Bus FO on their 13 year payscale. OTOH, the average Aug '99 LCAL hire is a 756 Captain, even if they're on a 11 year payscale.

I know which one I'd rather be.


There are 6 756 Captains on the April PBS awards with seniority above 2646 which is July '98 hire. I would say you are over stating your argument a wee bit.

EWRflyr 03-17-2013 09:15 AM


Originally Posted by untied (Post 1371778)
There is a written opinion by him advocating the importance of DOH in the SLI.

No. There is an opinion written by him regarding service credit for furloughed pilots who were recalled after the merger and prior to the ISL. His position based on what I read was that though a pilot may have been furloughed at the time of the merger if he was recalled to his airline prior to SLI he should be given some credit for the amount of time spent on property. That is completely different than a DOH argument you imply.

I'm not being hypocritical in regards to my signature line here. Just making a correction to something erroneous in your statement.


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