nickbvt82

All

After unsuccessful interviews with united and fedex this spring, I am faced with deciding between AA that gave me a Jan 7 th CJO last week and a Jan 7th start with UPS ( in pool for 6 months )
I am military ( flying reservist) and would happily love in one of the AA domiciles but am not sure yet about the UPS ones.
Looking for thoughts from people at UPS about commuting ( from va beach specifically) QOL, projected seniority .. anything really

Thanks in advance.

BoilerUP

If you're at Oceana, there's some UPS folks there that can give you first-hand gouge on the commute to SDF.

tnkrdrvr

I’m no longer a commuter and never commuted from Norfolk, but it should be fairly easy on days when the UPS flight out of Norfolk lines up with your trip out of Louisville. Also, check how often commercial flights go from Norfolk to SDF. QOL at UPS is great so long as your mentality is that you are there to make money to support your lifestyle. If you have ambitions of managerial greatness go to AA. Seniority at UPS will advance at a similar rate to AA. The numbers are smaller because we are far smaller in total pilot bodies, but percentages for retirement are similar and we are growing (for now anyway). You could absolutely make captain at AA faster, but that’s because UPS doesn’t fly small narrow body jets that senior guys avoid. Also, an FO at UPS can easily make $200k year two. So you will likely be doing far better financially than as reservist or a year 2-5 AA FO. That said, upgrade times are starting to fall rapidly here. I wouldn’t count that particular egg until it hatches for you though. Finally, take a long look at retirement planning with you at AA versus UPS. Their B plan isn’t bad (16% company contribution of first $285k earned) versus our B plan (12% company contribution of first $285k earned). Their A plan (absolutely nothing) kind of blows versus our A plan ($4200 times years of service if you retire as a captain). We also have a small VEBA ($1 for each credit hour), not sure about AA. Finally, I would argue that the IPA does a far better job for its members than the APA, but I haven’t directly experienced it, so take that opinion with a grain of salt.

FTv3

We’ve covered QOL, commuting, realistic pay expectations, upgrade times, seniority progression, and lots more in these threads over the past few years. Browse through thread titles, search posts by myself, FTFF, BoilerUp, Whalesurfer, saltydog, 767pilot, (ignore pastV1by10), and some of the others and you will have more I formation that you are even asking for but a very realistic and informed picture to work with.

Best of luck.

C2078

You will not go wrong with either. The differentiators with Brown: you will make more money quicker and you will have a pension. Downside, if not your thing, you will fly mostly between 10pm and 6am. Of course there is day flying, but it will take a bit of time to hold it consistently.

FTv3

Schedules too: we tend to do longer blocks on the road with associated longer blocks at home. Good for commuters.

Intl: we typically stay in theatre doing hub stuff in Asia or Europe, loops around continents, or around the world strings. Very little out and backs.

No travel bennies beyond some zed fares but with a little effort you can get mid to high level status with an airline of your choice and buy tickets / use miles when you need to go somewhere.

The environment / work experience loosely resembles a mil operation. Van rides to your plane, operations locations not fancy - outright dumps in a couple places, there are never customers anywhere near our operations so it’s totally different than the pax side. Easier, less BS: security, pee when you want, fly in your pajamas, cook brauts on flights out of Germany, etc...

PolarTiger

your in a good position my friend. you cannot go wrong ethier way. personally I would go with the NO Commute option.

Airbum

you should spend 3-4 days jumpseating around the system and sleeping during the day. If you don't, you have no idea what your are getting into compared to AA. Our life is mostly second and third shift work.

Not having PAX is great, flying nights? won't know until you do it for awhile.

robxjt27

UPS is the easiest commute I’ve ever had in my career. Private message me and I’ll be happy to explain why. It’s not something passenger carrier commuters think about. It is dependent on your outstation though of course. But man there are some good ones. I commuted to EWR, ORD and IAH for 10 years when I flew passengers and that took more years off my life than ever flying at night.

robxjt27

By the way, I was at UPS about 18 months when I started holding over 70% day flying.