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Old 07-16-2021, 02:52 PM   #1  
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Default New gateways

Start flying to TLV, LCA and IST in Nov. Long time overdue. But good news nonetheless.
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Old 07-16-2021, 03:48 PM   #2  
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Start flying to TLV, LCA and IST in Nov. Long time overdue. But good news nonetheless.
Outstanding news! More flying is more good. Good job to everyone who kept pushing to make this happen. Of course, now I have to find some way to get by without the penalty payment every month.
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Old 07-17-2021, 11:52 PM   #3  
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Start flying to TLV, LCA and IST in Nov. Long time overdue. But good news nonetheless.
​​
Fantastic news!!! Two incredible cites we now may explore.. super exited!!!

Let’s hope no ipa pilot “feels unsafe” flying into TLV or IST. If they do it’ll only take about 21 years before another IPA pilot may be able to fly to those cities..

Sorry to be this blunt BUT it’s true..
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Old 07-18-2021, 09:22 PM   #4  
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​​
Fantastic news!!! Two incredible cites we now may explore.. super exited!!!

Let’s hope no ipa pilot “feels unsafe” flying into TLV or IST. If they do it’ll only take about 21 years before another IPA pilot may be able to fly to those cities..

Sorry to be this blunt BUT it’s true..
The threat of being blown up by a suicide bomber was very real in that timeframe, Sorry to be blunt BUT it’s true.
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Old 07-19-2021, 12:05 AM   #5  
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The threat of being blown up by a suicide bomber was very real in that timeframe, Sorry to be blunt BUT it’s true.
Was it now? Really? Can you back it up with any numbers or is it all so-I’ve-heard “truth”?? What has changed since then? Anything? Has the terrorism threat diminished? Yeah, didn’t think so..

(By the way, yours is the excuse management has used for years and years to keep that flying away from us. After all, it cost them 90% less when the Turkish outfit flew it.)

Tank - WTF!?! - I used to follow your replies.

I feel safer in “bad areas” of Tel Aviv or Istanbul (been to both - numerous times!) than I do in “good areas” of Chicago or Detroit.

Hell, we might as well give up on ALL of our international flying based on your mindset. Wow!! 😢😢😢

PLEASE DO NOT BID ANY OF THOSE TRIPS!! It only took us close to 21 years to get those trips back since the last cadre of people with your perception refused to fly them!!

Last edited by whalesurfer; 07-19-2021 at 12:20 AM.
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Old 07-19-2021, 12:46 AM   #6  
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There are whole fleets where they never make you go out of the US...
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Old 07-19-2021, 11:02 AM   #7  
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Was it now? Really? Can you back it up with any numbers or is it all so-I’ve-heard “truth”?? What has changed since then? Anything? Has the terrorism threat diminished? Yeah, didn’t think so.. Yes, it demonstrably has diminished in Tel Aviv. The Israelis changed tactics to limit the ability of Palestinians, who didn’t hold Israeli citizenship, to enter the country. Just Google the wall Israel built between the West Bank Palestinian areas and Israel.

(By the way, yours is the excuse management has used for years and years to keep that flying away from us. After all, it cost them 90% less when the Turkish outfit flew it.) I heard it from fellow IPA guys who were around then. Management has definitely been taking advantage of the situation, but the last few years of delay has been driven by the Turks trying to protect their own carrier. Still on management to comply with the contract.

Tank - WTF!?! - I used to follow your replies.

I feel safer in “bad areas” of Tel Aviv or Istanbul (been to both - numerous times!) than I do in “good areas” of Chicago or Detroit. I totally agree, many of our domestic layovers are significantly less safe than Tel Aviv. I’m not sure anyone thought Istanbul was unsafe. That said, the danger from terrorism versus random street crime tends to be looked at very differently by a lot of people, even though your risk statistically from terrorism is very low.

Hell, we might as well give up on ALL of our international flying based on your mindset. Wow!! 😢😢😢

I think you are misinterpreting my point. The reality is a lot of our coworkers have a relatively low tolerance for taking perceived risks just to hold a route. Just look at the debates on the B&G about China flying. I personally would love a Tel Aviv or Istanbul layover. The MD would be a great fit for that route

PLEASE DO NOT BID ANY OF THOSE TRIPS!! It only took us close to 21 years to get those trips back since the last cadre of people with your perception refused to fly them!!
See the answers in red above.
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Old 07-19-2021, 12:10 PM   #8  
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Tank - I read your replies and you’re making some valid points. However, every single one of those points can be applied to other cities/countries we’re currently flying to.

People who worry about the issues you raised shouldn’t bid international. If that’s all they can hold then maybe they should look into swa or other domestic carriers? I mean it sincerely - we ARE an international carrier and we will always fly to places some find dangerous.

Frankly, I can’t believe I’m having a debate here with another IPA’er over whether we should be flying those extra trips or not? EB fought a hard, multi-year long battle to win those flights back. I trust my EB and I am super stoked my union brothers and sisters will get to fly them. I hope one day the whale will go there too.
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Old 07-19-2021, 08:16 PM   #9  
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Frankly, I can’t believe I’m having a debate here with another IPA’er over whether we should be flying those extra trips or not?
I don’t read that he is arguing with you about it. He just pointed out that TLV was significantly more hostile in the past perhaps justifying the outsourcing for a limited time frame. Agree that nervous travelers are problematic but argue that this extends to the domestic as well as international theaters.

Also, our Chicago l/o area is pretty GD safe unless you’re alluding to certain death by crappy, unhealthy yuppie chain restaurant food or high end outlet mall shopping….? Plenty of cities could have supported your argument much stronger: ATL, old OAK, SJU, ANC…?
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Old 07-21-2021, 04:26 AM   #10  
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Senior guys,

Please don’t bid the new flying and let it go junior.

Sincerely,
- junior guy
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