Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver

You're either not comprehending the question or you're just trying to side step it. Again, this is what I asked:

Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver
Okay (and this question is for Johnso too)...

If a flight crew member determines for himself that exactly 8 hours behind the door is sufficient, is he legal?

Ask yourself the following two questions:

1 - Does FAR 117 require an 8 hour uninterrupted sleep opportunity?

2 - With exactly 8 hours behind the door (the 8 hour clock starts the moment you walk through the door into the room and it stops the moment you walk out of the door the next morning), does ANY human being have the opportunity to get 8 hours of sleep?

There is no decision to make in that scenario. It's cut and dried. The FAR requires an opportunity to get 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep. Exactly 8 hours behind the door does not provide that... for ANYONE. The only decision to be made is how much MORE time (over 8 hours) is needed in order for you to have the opportunity to get 8 hours of sleep. THAT is what can vary from person to person.

For me personally, I know from experience that I need a minimum of 20 minutes (30 is better) from the time I walk into a hotel room until I'm ready to lay down and start trying to go to sleep. In the morning, I need a minimum of 30 minutes (I usually allow 45 minutes) to get up and get ready. So, for me the absolute minimum answer is going to be about 9 hours behind the door. Your mileage may vary. But it can't vary all the way down to 8 hours behind the door (or less)... because you would be in violation of FAR 117. Calling in fatigued is a whole separate issue.

If you don't get it by now, then you're just not going to (or you don't want to). Good luck.