That's how I have heard it also. Membership vote would be more like a straw poll to give the BOD "direction." Legally. the timeline is reaching its conclusion so I doubt it will go to the membership. Scope vs. MTA, the $$$ would have to be significant even for a few seats...but then again, the MTA is lousy and it would be a long time before we see negotiations again. Obviously, where you are seniority wise is key to how see it, and the SLI is another factor that will make a difference.

 

I predict there will be two outcomes:

Either

1) AAL management offers best final offer of Delta +5% with 2016 parity as well, if APA gives up 5 seats in scope...no profit sharing. Last minute offer at end of 30 day window. SK has mentioned exactly just this in crew meetings.

2) AAL management says ok fine then, we will go to arbitration and you will get industry standard as in just what was spelled out in the MOU.

Option 1 gives good pay raises and many older pilots who don't give a hoot about the continuous erosion of scope will want it. Option 2 holds the line philosophically on scope but the pilots will still be behind DAL pay.

AA/US pilots are in a good place, but also in a good corner in terms of negotiating a great contract AND holding line at 76 seats.

 

A321,

Scope cannot be arbitrated!!!!! That was in the MTA ( merger transition agreement ), the other stuff is all up for grabs. The only way that scope can possibly be open for arbitration is if we talk about it during these negotiations. So don't expect them to discuss this topic at this time.

We will see where this process takes us pretty quickly, once the FA's are done voting. They have show that they are willing to pay Delta rates, so let's what AAL actually slides across the table. LOS has been costed out $19 million, which is a drop in the bucket when it comes to a third quarter profit of over $1B! If they are willing to compensate us accordingly then this get done pretty quick. If not, then this will take a while and the membership will have to get involved. I believe that we should spin up SPC, ( strike preparedness committee ) just so what we can get the word about in a more timely fashion, and then if need be we can step it up after that.

Scope relief is a nonstarter, I believe that Kirby knows it, he is just fishing to see what the response would be. If they like those planes then we can fly them. I don't care who is behind the door, below the floor or behind the counter. All that matters is who is behind the controls of that plane, period end of story.

Best to all of us

 

Re-read A321's post. He never said that scope could be arbitrated. It's was quite the opposite.

 

I'm patient..option 2 is fine with me. At this point we should be giving up nothing for an ILC. NO SCOPE GIVES PERIOD.

If Parker/Kirby want to see this place implode they will get it by not getting a deal done within the timelines. Especially considering how good a deal the F/As received. I believe they are smarter than this but we shall see. I'm already disappointed with their list of rejected items so far.

 

The FAs got industry leading yes, but they didn't have scope to worry about for leverage. The 5 seat advantage for leverage lies with the pilots. Do you think they are just going to give us DAL + 5% without asking for something to trade? The FAs had nothing to trade that management wanted.

On another subject, can someone describe LOS to me? It hasn't been described to me, I just keep hearing about it. Thanks.

 

Love this statement! You just summed up more succinctly than an entire page, why not to trade concessions for a quick upgrade.

 

A321,

The leverage we have are the throttles! Scope will not be discussed at this time, so I am not worried about losing any portion of what we have there. This group ( parker and kirby ) has been told over and over again that they can expect again if we get tired of their crap. All we have to do is just do our jobs period end of story. We stop helping all of the other departments out and just focus on flying safely and things will come to a slow grinding roll. So that is our leverage we don't need to discuss scope. We can talk about the next generation of 175's that is fine because they fall outside of the scope parameters. We have already told them we will fly them no problem. This is a self correcting problem just so long as we hold the line on scope. We know it and so do they, that is why Kirby is out there on his fishing expadiation.

So if the FA's didn't have any leverage then how did they get the payrates? Parker said that when started to make money like Delta then we would get paid like Delta. Well it looks like we are making money like them, so we will see how long it takes for them to pony up the bucks.

Talk to your reps on LOS, they can talk to that much better than me.

 

Keep in mind this is all just third-hand rumor-mill stuff...but I've flown with a few guys tied into what's going on. They are all pretty optimistic we'll see a JCBA fairly quick, and that Kirby's scope talk has mostly been to "test the waters" and see how receptive we are to it.

This management group is all about trying to complete labor negotiations fast so they can move on to other things. There are bigger issues within the merger and they don't want to get hung up on labor problems.

I think the scope thing will be thrown out there. APA will probably tell them no, and in the end we'll wind up getting some kind of Delta+ contract, without profit sharing. It seems Parker is pretty adamant about not doing profit sharing. He'd rather pay a premium above Delta than give us a share of the profits. Whatever. In any case, I'm willing to bet we'll see something halfway decent approved over the next month or two. I don't think it'll go to arbitration.

 

How will we see something in the next month or two and it not be arbitrated? Am I missing something or??