Atlas/Southern crews relative value.
01-30-2021, 09:02 AM
#101
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Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,350
Originally Posted by zerozero
This is a "blame the victim" mentality. It's like the abusive parent blaming the child for his beating: "I wouldn't have to hit you so much if you'd just take out the trash a little earlier!"
Look, this is a business, or supposed to be one at least. But when the pilot group has a whole list of grievances (literal and figurative) well, maybe it's not just about us for a change.
Maybe it's time to drag this organization into the 21st Century for the benefit of everyone, senior ones and junior ones, and even those who aren't on the property yet.
Look, this is a business, or supposed to be one at least. But when the pilot group has a whole list of grievances (literal and figurative) well, maybe it's not just about us for a change.
Maybe it's time to drag this organization into the 21st Century for the benefit of everyone, senior ones and junior ones, and even those who aren't on the property yet.
It takes a systemic approach. Clearly some of my friends and I disagree with the specifics on decisions made in our name, but the pilots aren't the problem to focus on now. Besides, pressuring pilots hasn't worked here or at other airlines yet.
I'm not saying pilots aren't self destructive. We just might be more productive focusing on something else.
Last edited by Elevation; 01-30-2021 at 09:21 AM.
01-30-2021, 10:48 AM
#102
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 694
Originally Posted by Elevation
I agree with this.
It takes a systemic approach. Clearly some of my friends and I disagree with the specifics on decisions made in our name, but the pilots aren't the problem to focus on now. Besides, pressuring pilots hasn't worked here or at other airlines yet.
I'm not saying pilots aren't self destructive. We just might be more productive focusing on something else.
It takes a systemic approach. Clearly some of my friends and I disagree with the specifics on decisions made in our name, but the pilots aren't the problem to focus on now. Besides, pressuring pilots hasn't worked here or at other airlines yet.
I'm not saying pilots aren't self destructive. We just might be more productive focusing on something else.
Every single improvement came from the pilot group. Not management. Management is still locked into their mid-1990 charter outfit mentality.
Over the last 10 years we have hired an incredibly experienced, diverse and talented group of pilots.
Every student of sociology knows that all organizations have two types of leaders: "Formal" and "Informal". It's the informal leaders who are teaching our so called "superiors" how to run this organization.
If someone quits to go somewhere else, well, good for them, but no one should diminish the hard work being done by those who have committed the rest of their professional lives to making things better for everyone else.
01-31-2021, 09:10 PM
#103
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Joined APC: Sep 2020
Posts: 407
Originally Posted by zerozero
This is a "blame the victim" mentality. It's like the abusive parent blaming the child for his beating: "I wouldn't have to hit you so much if you'd just take out the trash a little earlier!"
Look, this is a business, or supposed to be one at least. But when the pilot group has a whole list of grievances (literal and figurative) well, maybe it's not just about us for a change.
Maybe it's time to drag this organization into the 21st Century for the benefit of everyone, senior ones and junior ones, and even those who aren't on the property yet.
Look, this is a business, or supposed to be one at least. But when the pilot group has a whole list of grievances (literal and figurative) well, maybe it's not just about us for a change.
Maybe it's time to drag this organization into the 21st Century for the benefit of everyone, senior ones and junior ones, and even those who aren't on the property yet.
02-03-2021, 07:45 PM
#104
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Joined APC: Nov 2019
Posts: 50
Originally Posted by zerozero
Over the last 10 years we have hired an incredibly experienced, diverse and talented group of pilots.
02-04-2021, 02:45 AM
#105
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Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 2,427
Originally Posted by PolarTiger
Incredibly Experienced? Are you talking about the guy who flew at a Regional a whole 3 months before coming here or the guy who had never flown above FL250 before coming here? Atlas has consistently been hiring the un-hireables in an attempt to stop attrition. I'm sorry to say, but the experience level of some new hires here is questionable.
02-04-2021, 02:56 AM
#106
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Joined APC: Sep 2015
Posts: 666
Originally Posted by Swakid8
‘Lately it’s been Compass, ExpressJet, Expats coming back home from the ME3, Military folks getting hired unless you are on the 73...
That being said, before Covid-19 created the massive influx of applicants, there were undoubtedly a couple of years where we were reduced to hiring anyone who would walk up to an interview. No doubt, some of those people have little business being in the front of an airplane.
Last edited by RyeMex; 02-04-2021 at 03:08 AM.
02-04-2021, 06:01 AM
#107
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 694
Originally Posted by PolarTiger
Incredibly Experienced? Are you talking about the guy who flew at a Regional a whole 3 months before coming here or the guy who had never flown above FL250 before coming here? Atlas has consistently been hiring the un-hireables in an attempt to stop attrition. I'm sorry to say, but the experience level of some new hires here is questionable.
Yes, incredibly experienced pilots from Evergreen, World, ATA, Kalitta, Emirates, Qatar, Etihad, all the regionals, etc.
You can cr@p on their experience, especially the regional guys, if it makes you feel better (in retirement <wink>) but I won't.
02-05-2021, 03:14 PM
#108
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 694
Did You Know?
A duty-rig is a common pay protection found in most contracts throughout our industry. Duty-rigs become more relevant with less productive flying in a duty period. A long duty period that contains a few short flights within that period would pay a pilot more than the actual flight time or CRT.
Alaska, American, Delta, FedEx, Hawaiian, JetBlue, Southwest, United, and UPS are a few of the many airlines that have a duty-rig. The pilots working for these listed companies benefit from a duty-rig of at least one hour of pay for every two hours of duty (1:2). At Atlas Air, we do not currently have a duty-rig in our contract.
02-10-2021, 06:53 PM
#109
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Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: Capt
Posts: 3,215
Originally Posted by 6ix9ineYearFlow
Is it true that negotiations fell apart and there's a risk now that arbitration may be getting delayed yet again next year?
02-12-2021, 02:52 PM
#110
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 694
Did You Know?
A senior pilot at Hawaiian Airlines, an airline with a pilot group that is only a third of our size, earns a maximum of 38 days of vacation each year. At United Airlines, a senior pilot earns a maximum of 42 days of vacation each year. At Atlas Air, a pilot reaches a maximum of only 21 days of vacation each year. This is exactly half of the vacation benefit offered by United Airlines.
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