Hey, I broke 62hrs back in September!

747 doesnt have a backlog. This light be the case for 767

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The numbers don't add up. They probably need an additional 250 pilots by year's end on our list and I think they can probably train around 350. They'll have way more than 100 departures this year plus retirements.

FWIW
As of the March 1st seniority list, Atlas has at least 24 more mandatory retirements in 2017...

DC8driver, what is the total amount of pilots at atlas now?

As of Feb 15th, 1448.

Guys, Ive been following this thread for like 4 years now and one of my only times posting. I would really like an unbiased opinion of whats going on and if its worth it to make this jump to Atlas. I was offered the test (havent taken it yet). Ive also done my due diligence. Its just so crazy to me to see the change in the group just from 3 years ago to now. I always have had my eyes on Atlas but now reading all this from posters on here Im really having second thoughts. I understand all the frustration and I would really like to make a sound decision as this would be a big move if I made it through the process. Im a regional 121 captain. I for the most part understand the pay and lifestyle deal with Atlas. My big question is are the doors really coming off the company? Are furloughs in the future potentially? Will everything come to a halt? I noticed theres a big movement from guys on here to not get new hires to come and painting this really lousy picture. Is it really that bad? Is it really because they are looking out for the new guy or are they trying to get one over on managment so they cant staff and have to come to the table? I understand all of it. I feel the frustration for the group but this is something ive been mulling over. Its a bummer Atlas was always one of the places at the top of my list. I mean hes got the world on his shoulders on the tail of the plane...with the call sign Giant! Thats pretty bada**. Anyway any advice looking at both sides would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.

Things are bad with no end in sight. It's not just that the company wants to dictate to us every item in a joint cba without the pilots negotiating or having a say on any of it (and they are willing to litigate in months long court battles to do it). It's also that they are vindictive. You can forget about having requests approved by scheduling or the travel department. "You want good catering?? We can make it worse.. see?? Eat this".. "You want a contractually compliant hotel? Ok stay in this dump. It meets all the parameters.. bed bugs and keyless door entry included"

Although we as pilots make up 70% of the workforce, we are treated as indentures servants. Stick your head up while on probation and whack, you're fired! There has been a directive from the top brass to make today's workday worse than the last. To wear us down. It's a slow agonizing torture and it's intentional. Depending on what regional you work for you would know the feeling. Skywest excluded, of course.

But does anyone really take advice these days?

How many other airlines do you know where captains making over $200 an hour are leaving to start on the bottom of another list? That should tell you all you need to know. Until the company changes their position Atlas will not be growing or stable due to attrition in my opinion. Good luck with your choice.

I could not overstate my strong discouragement in a decision to accept a job at Atlas. The situation has degraded to a point of no return in my opinion. I am 50% seniority in the 767 left seat and I will be leaving skid marks in the parking lot out of this place at my first opportunity. When I get out of here I hope I am never in line behind an Atlas crew at a hotel the rest of my life because you can count on the reservations being screwed up and it taking 20 minutes to get them checked in. A total embarrassment of an airline.

The company is suing us. You don't seem to pay attention at all. Enter at your own risk. You have been warned.

The guarantee is 62 hours but if one does a 17 day line then the CRT rig winds up being worth 81 hours or so. Being out over 13 days gets into overtime based on CRT. It's not unheard of for CS to clip four days off of the end of a 17 day pairing and replace them with home reserve to avoid this.

It is completely unrealistic to expect 80 hrs per month. Yes it is mathematically possible to start a pattern of 17 days in a row at 00:01z after you commuted potentially 2 days prior to get in position with 10hrs rest, then end your pattern at 23:59z on the last day, and then gateway/commute/pay taxes on an airline ticket/go home/whatever you want to call it. Some of the bids are published at 82 hours but as soon as they change anything it will drop. Vacation, training, sick, welcome back to 62hrs.

It's horrible here. Coming here would be a terrible career move. I know 15+ year 747 Captains who plan to just quit with no other job lined up... We're that ****ed.

If you do come expect to make about $40K your first year and fly with guys that are furious.

On 5th year pay at $117 an hour last year I totaled about $10K over guarantee. Expect to make your rate times your guarantee here.

thanks twin

If you've been reading this thread for 4 years, you know the story well and yes, it is that bad. What good will the company had fostered with the pilot group in the last five years after Atlas and Polar merged was ripped out from under us, shat upon, and thrown back in our faces. And this has happened as management has taken a 66 million bonus for themselves and then sued us for trying to bring them to the bargaining table to complete the negotiations they they had begun with us.

There are so many other airlines at which an Atlas qualified pilot could get hired and establish a decent career. A side trip to Atlas would be a waste of your time.

8

Short term career advice
 

First read this: Atlasfacts.org

Then read this: https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/h...ts-2017-a.html

Then go here: https://workforcenow.adp.com/jobs/ap...=MP&lang=en_US

True, however, 10 of them are already on LMED.

$66 million dollar bonus handed out to 5 management types. Call in sick, 62hr guarantee, Death in the family, 62hr guarantee, at the whim of crew scheduling 62hr guarantee, ETC. Need I say anymore, ALLOUT 2017.

Kind of a moot point in my opinion because 10 more will likely replace them... Others will retire before 65. I bet we need to replace more than 30 Captains who won't be flying or instructing for whatever reason.

All OUT 2017

Additional rumor: 767 new hire class canceled.

Any idea which class date and why?

3/20. No clue on reason.

Looks like the new hire 767 class was cancelled (delayed) to make room for the Florida West class short course with 18 pilots.

BayBum

Nothing to see here folks, move along

The short course puts them closer to OE and adds to the backlog pushing NH classes back.

Wonder if anyone knowing or Kalitta guys can chime in here; Do Kalitta pilots get paid what they are at least awarded or do they get cut short with the above circumstances?

If a K4 pilot is awarded a line with 80 credit hours you will get paid 80 hours except for sick calls which will reduce you to guarantee. but if you schedule changes, or you mx cox,,,etc....you still get the bid line guarantee. If you have vacation you get a build up RSV line.

The 3/2 FW class of 18 will finish Indoc then break apart and resume for Systems as a 3/27 class and a 4/17 class, taking the place of previously announced 767 classes.

Talk about leverage. The same group once pushed away now gets courted to come in. Score 1 for pilots.

Leverage? Going alone obviously went well. Now they start as Newhires from day one.

No problem. At these attrition levels they'll be in captain upgrade class in 6 months....lol. :)

Haha exactly!

Rumor is that the wash out rate has spiked again on the 747. You might want to consider how prepared you are for taking a job at Atlas because you can do permanent damage to your resume....

Well, what constitutes a spike?

New hires making more money than a Southern year 5 FO.


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Beware the bait and switch! Tell applicants
 

Atlas pilot applicants beware of bait and switch!
The pilot recruiting effort at Atlas has become so desperate that Atlas managers are apparently attempting to lure new hires who have not done their homework into accepting a position with Southern Air. Atlas Air managers are enticing pilot applicants with the false promise of a new contract with improved terms and pay by later this year. But the CEO Bill Flynn is already on ...record with investors during the February 23, 2017 earnings call explaining that pilot costs will not change this year (i.e. no new contract).
As Atlas and Southern struggle to staff airframes, managers are also promising a complete seniority integration between the two carriers as well as a new and improved contract. Both Atlas and Southern contracts (CBAs) are posted on this website under the "Pilots" tab, but here are the important FACTS about accepting a position at Southern in lieu of a position at Atlas. Your success at this organization depends on you performing your own due diligence in order to navigate the misleading and often false information coming from headquarters.
Southern guarantee 60 hours.
Pay $61.20 - Year 1.
$69.95 - Year 2.
$73.03 - Year 3.
$2,000 per month/first four months.
Per Diem $2.50.
20 days on / per month.
Rig 3.5 / per day.
Atlas FOs make 92% of a Southern captain. Southern FOs make 67% of what an Atlas B-747 FO makes.
Southern pilots work 20 days a month. Normally, that consists of flying two laps around the planet, adding up to 70+ hours over the course of 14 to 17 days, which is typically followed by sitting reserve at no extra pay until reaching 20 days since you likely will have already broke the 70-hour mark.
As a junior pilot, the odds of working back-to-back months (40 days out) are pretty good.
Upgrade is currently 10 years on the 777. If you are planning to build PIC time, chances of that happening are not likely.
Junior assignment happens often and cannot be refused. If crew scheduling talks to you, you cannot say no.
Medical is pricey and, at best, the plan is poor.
If you do commercial, you will get coach and the odds are good that you will get to enjoy a center seat.
Vacation, you get two vacation periods a year. A vacation line includes 15 work days, instead of 20.
Vacation periods cannot be taken in the same month. Many vacation lines have you flying two quick laps around the planet and then home for 15 days.

Just in case anyone is still considering Atlas. Even if you are contemplating coming to Atlas for a type and some time.....6 new hires have been fired since January and you don't want that on your resume.

Atlas Air takes pilots to court as it attempts to stem growing labour costs - The Loadstar


BayBum :mad: