Looking for advice about flying in the US
02-26-2018 | 08:25 AM
#11
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,908
Likes: 693
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
Hi everyone,
I’m in the same situation as aviator35. I’m trying to figure out if it’s worth self-sponsoring for the ATP-CTP (as I understand foreign ATP isn’t considered there) for a shot at the majors or if it’s better to just let a regional pay for it.
In addition to aviator35’s questions, I’d like to ask if anyone knows how Cruise Relief Pilot (Second Officer) time is counted by US airlines or the FAA. I have 2800 hrs, but 1900 hrs are from A330 & A340 CRP. I would sit on the right seat 2/3 of cruising time and wasn’t authorized to do take offs and landings on actual flights. I’d do 3 TOs and Landings on the sim every 90 days. Currently a 320 FO in Asia, but only 500 hrs on the type.
(I know this has been asked before on multiple threads, but I haven’t seen any concrete answers. I’m hoping someone can offer insight on this!)
I’m in the same situation as aviator35. I’m trying to figure out if it’s worth self-sponsoring for the ATP-CTP (as I understand foreign ATP isn’t considered there) for a shot at the majors or if it’s better to just let a regional pay for it.
In addition to aviator35’s questions, I’d like to ask if anyone knows how Cruise Relief Pilot (Second Officer) time is counted by US airlines or the FAA. I have 2800 hrs, but 1900 hrs are from A330 & A340 CRP. I would sit on the right seat 2/3 of cruising time and wasn’t authorized to do take offs and landings on actual flights. I’d do 3 TOs and Landings on the sim every 90 days. Currently a 320 FO in Asia, but only 500 hrs on the type.
(I know this has been asked before on multiple threads, but I haven’t seen any concrete answers. I’m hoping someone can offer insight on this!)
It's legally equivalent to any other SIC time, although all else being equal an airline might prefer an SIC who was actually PF for entire legs T/O to LDG.
02-26-2018 | 08:58 AM
#12
On Reserve
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 113
Likes: 3
This is concerning- I know someone who is busy doing his upgrade as we speak with a regional airline who got most of his 8000 hours abroad- does the airline not know the regulations? Don’t tell me the FAA is going to prevent him from being PIC after all he has been through?
02-26-2018 | 10:43 AM
#13
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Thanks! With that, should someone who logged CRP time somehow note that on his/her CV and application to avoid any sort of misrepresentation of time?
02-26-2018 | 10:58 AM
#14
All is fine at .79
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 4,486
Likes: 42
From: Paahlot
You’re overthinking this.
If you are a required crew member you can log SIC.
If your operation requires a 3-4 man Crew because of duty times or flight times you may count the entire flight duration as SIC.
Personally I don’t do that.
I just log in-seat time as SIC.
So your cruise relief pilot time is SIC time.
But you still need 1000 hrs SIC under FAA rules prior to upgrade.
That’s what the reg says.
Looking for 121.436 advice.
If you are a required crew member you can log SIC.
If your operation requires a 3-4 man Crew because of duty times or flight times you may count the entire flight duration as SIC.
Personally I don’t do that.
I just log in-seat time as SIC.
So your cruise relief pilot time is SIC time.
But you still need 1000 hrs SIC under FAA rules prior to upgrade.
That’s what the reg says.
Looking for 121.436 advice.
02-26-2018 | 03:20 PM
#15
On Reserve
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 138
Likes: 4
This is concerning- I know someone who is busy doing his upgrade as we speak with a regional airline who got most of his 8000 hours abroad- does the airline not know the regulations? Don’t tell me the FAA is going to prevent him from being PIC after all he has been through?
I still moved to the US but I commute to China for work.
02-27-2018 | 06:25 AM
#16
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,908
Likes: 693
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
Look on the various airline applications... they slice and dice flight time in a lot of different ways but I don't recall any of the US airlines differentiating IRO time.
02-27-2018 | 06:27 AM
#17
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,908
Likes: 693
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
This is concerning- I know someone who is busy doing his upgrade as we speak with a regional airline who got most of his 8000 hours abroad- does the airline not know the regulations? Don’t tell me the FAA is going to prevent him from being PIC after all he has been through?
If they don't catch it right away and he gets on line, it could get ugly later. I think he needs to address that with the training dept and CMO leadership.
If the CMO lets him do it, then he'll probably get away with it, but remotely possible a future potential employer would notice the regulatory air gap at an interview.
You can look this one up on the FAA website, pretty sure Legal issued a letter addressing this.
02-28-2018 | 09:09 PM
#18
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
You’re overthinking this.
If you are a required crew member you can log SIC.
If your operation requires a 3-4 man Crew because of duty times or flight times you may count the entire flight duration as SIC.
Personally I don’t do that.
I just log in-seat time as SIC.
So your cruise relief pilot time is SIC time.
But you still need 1000 hrs SIC under FAA rules prior to upgrade.
That’s what the reg says.
Looking for 121.436 advice.
If you are a required crew member you can log SIC.
If your operation requires a 3-4 man Crew because of duty times or flight times you may count the entire flight duration as SIC.
Personally I don’t do that.
I just log in-seat time as SIC.
So your cruise relief pilot time is SIC time.
But you still need 1000 hrs SIC under FAA rules prior to upgrade.
That’s what the reg says.
Looking for 121.436 advice.
Follow up question. Let's say I continue to build my time up to 4000-5000 hrs here in Asia (no TPIC since I don't see myself getting upgraded to the left anytime soon), would it be worth paying for an ATP-CTP so I can try applying for a major or are the chances still slim and is it better to go to a regional first and let them pay for it? How long are contracts with regional airlines?
03-01-2018 | 06:52 AM
#20
All is fine at .79
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 4,486
Likes: 42
From: Paahlot
I am overthinking! I have been for a while after reading a lot of different views on this, but this clears things up. Thank you.
Thank you. SIC it is. That works for me.
Follow up question. Let's say I continue to build my time up to 4000-5000 hrs here in Asia (no TPIC since I don't see myself getting upgraded to the left anytime soon), would it be worth paying for an ATP-CTP so I can try applying for a major or are the chances still slim and is it better to go to a regional first and let them pay for it? How long are contracts with regional airlines?
Thank you. SIC it is. That works for me.
Follow up question. Let's say I continue to build my time up to 4000-5000 hrs here in Asia (no TPIC since I don't see myself getting upgraded to the left anytime soon), would it be worth paying for an ATP-CTP so I can try applying for a major or are the chances still slim and is it better to go to a regional first and let them pay for it? How long are contracts with regional airlines?
Find a state with no income tax
https://taxfoundation.org/state-individual-income-tax-rates-brackets-2017/
Alternatively try one of the ACMI’s
Atlas, Kalitta, World Global ( or whatever their name is)
Charter flying with Miami Air, Swift or Sun Country on 737
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