WN is a great gig. It’s also only a LCC when it suits them to pretend to be so.

Well this is kind of my point. I mean can those orders be delayed? Deferred? Definitely, will it happen? We don’t know, likely not. If everything stagnated, how long to upgrade and how long to hold a line once you upgrade. I was just saying the legacies will have a clearer timeline because of retirements. I don’t look down on the LCCs I think they have great pay and QoL especially now. I just have noticed a negative sentiment from people who gave up on legacies and are going to LCCs about said legacies. Not everyone but a tendency to say oh it’s way better here, that legacy model won’t work, kind of a bash the legacy on the way out the door mentality. I don’t know if it’s an insecurity, a justification or what not.

Also the second point was I believe all the passenger carriers would’ve had to shut their doors permanently if it wasn’t for government aid not just the ones with wide bodies.

Doubtful that any airline could have sustained 0 demand like we saw for months on end. Unless they have some other part of the company generating revenue. A saving grace for a lot of companies had to be moving cargo and freight at killer prices in wide body airplanes that would have otherwise been rotting on a ramp.

I love this thread because it’s always a hot topic and debate. I’ve met 787 FO’s from legacies who have never upgraded throughout their career. I’ve also been sim partners with people in their late 50’s who have flown the 74, 76, L1011, DC-8, and many others yet due to this business they have been shafted over and over. Truly a lottery.


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Agreed, this thread is refreshing. It's a good question and one that keeps coming up because there is no 'right' answer. I think the best answer probably comes from things like age, where you want to live, if you're willing to roll the dice on staying on the RJ. Like others have said, aside from the WB stuff, the NB wages aren't that different and neither is the 401k.

That being said, the near term movement at AA and UAL is absolutely eye watering and you'll presumably get a WB if that's your thing. The old precovid debate we all had as RJ pilots was which airline would withstand a recession best and maybe go there. So some preferred Spirit over AA... DAL over UAL.. and SWA was king with caveats related to a certain airplane. We had no idea what was coming and how it would play out. Turns out everyone was screwed and everyone made it! Lol.. RIP Alitalia. Who knows what the future will hold with the 321XLR.. NYCs "hometown airline" goes to London now.. Maybe you will see the world on an LCC in the future?

I'll throw this wrench into the discussion...

Breeze.

Now hear me out lol.. they are bleeding out the experienced former RJ captains. The movement to the left seat will be very fast. You can go there, upgrade quickly.. STILL get the RJ wage you know and love 😆, and fly a mainline airplane and decide from there. The door is also wide open there to extra curricula duties and that can help stack your resume for your dream job.

Thoughts?

How is WN pretending to be an LCC?

They have carefully nurtured their underdog rep for decades after they outgrew it, so they can throw that card down on the table when they're competing for slots, gates, special favors, etc or when un-competitive practices are alleged.

At this point it is a real stretch.

You could start with the fact that they aren’t low cost except for their selective wanna get away fares, and move on from there.

SWA was a LCC that has become a legacy, and still plays up that ruse for the masses who don’t pay attention.

You don’t get a lot of guys and gals in the regionals asking their friends and coworkers if they should upgrade in an RJ or take the SWA job offer because it has become a career destination airline. WN is not considered by most to be in the same tier as NK, F9 etc., and employment at those kind of operations is pretty clearly the question at hand.

Other legacy retirements has made SWA bit of a stepping stone again much to their consternation and chagrin, but they are a legacy.

I think something that is rarely discussed when talking about a legacy vs a LCC is the movement due to larger aircraft. I mean at this point I don’t have a real desire to fly WBs as an FO or a CA that could change. There will be movement above me though if I stay on the same plane I would at an LCC. Not just because the retirements are significantly greater but people above me probably will switch to a bigger plane. At say a Spirit/Frontier once a person gets CA and there base they aren’t going anywhere for a long time. Grant it there is still a lot of time it takes to move at a legacy also. If there is no growth it may take many years longer to get off reserve or to hold the line you want every month.

The L and the C in the category of LCC.

But as FNG said, WN has done an amazing job with brand loyalty; to the point they dont even need to compete their fares on travel booking sites, their passengers seek their fares out. SWA should teach a Masterclass on branding and brand loyalty.

Also, sending pizza to ATC towers around the country, brilliant! /haha

Clearly you don’t what a legacy airline is .You just don’t grow into a Legacy. WN business model is of a LCC, and that’s what they are .