Globemaster2827

So? A military pension isn't $1 million a year for life. IF he's getting an active duty one it's maybe half what his pay was when he retired. In retirement at 65 that may be the current equivalent of $3,000 a month. That isn't enough to retire on given what our life styles are. The notion that retirements don't matter for retired military guys/gals is silly.

What I get from the military in retirement is irrelevant. Which airline that I choose to work for had better have a damn good retirement program or my Apps will be up to date. ACMI carriers are losing younger candidates (military or not) primarily because of work rules and retirement. A rate may get me in the door but it certainly won't retain me when I can have the rate somewhere else plus an actual retirement with quality of life. Kalitta is ahead of Atlas but still woefully behind what it'd take to retain me....

Also, I'll throw this out there too. I factor $0 into my retirement planning from the military and I've got 21.5 years in. That's because - like any pension - it can be taken away from you at any time.

gollum

So by this line of thinking, the $40k UPS pension should also be figured in as $0 as it too (and more likely than a mil retirement ) can be taken away at any time. How many airline guys lost their pensions as at some point? How many military?

ocskyguy

Okay. Let’s look at the math. UPS or FedEx, never gonna make captain with ten years to go. So...

Retirement is better at brown or purple. But, if you are chucking $20k plus into a 401 for 10 years, with a $10k match, plus a low growth factor of around 4%, you got around $400k. And you get to factor in a waaayy shorter path to upgrade with the potential to crack $250 plus each year.

The big boys are good for young pilots. But, places like K4 make more sense for the 40+ crowd.

gollum

At Kalitta, we actually have pretty good work rules and a Chief Pilot who actually will step in and help you enforce those rules. No junior manning, no hold outs beyond your 16 scheduled days, no jumpseating to/from work or imputed income (increased taxable income) from company purchased tickets and most importantly, no crashpads.

Kalitta’s max double crew day is 24 hours followed by 22 hours of rest, so you are either thinking of someone else or just wrong. The 2-pilot (14 hours) and 3-pilot (17 hours) duty days are also pretty tolerable.

Kalitta has line guarantees. sorry that ATLAS doesn’t.

While seniority doesn’t help you get more days off it does help with getting the days you want off and getting those 85-90 hour lines. Me personally, I like knowing I am on the road for my 16 work days and then I am home for two weeks and not having to make multiple commutes to/from work eating into my time off. I guess it’s a different story if you live in/near base with a major but I like where I live and don’t want to move.


My point here: it’s all well and good that life at ATLAS is pretty poor right now and we sympathize with you, but when you try and dissuade someone from for a company, how about you stick to speaking for your own company and not a place you don’t work for.

When I first applied here I considered it a stepping stone (and a really good one) but since getting hired I have stopped updating my apps other places. It’s a great culture on the line and great people to fly with.

Stratocruzr

How long is that duty day??

gollum

As stated above:

Kalitta’s max double crew day is 24 hours followed by 22 hours of rest (and good couple of naps along the way). The 2-pilot (14 hours) and 3-pilot (17 hours) duty days are also pretty tolerable.

Stratocruzr

Catching up sorry don’t live in these boards.

Still too long. And I did clarify in my original statement May be confusing with someone else.

Bottom line ALL ACMI carriers work rules are light years behind most other carriers.

gollum

No disagreement on my end.

I was was more focused on his assertion that his argument on brown’s retirement being better than K4s because of a pension and that a mil retirement was not worth figuring in was made less relevant by his statement that a pension could be taken away at any time.

gollum

An my point was for you to stick to speaking for your own carrier and not ours as we seem to like it over here. But alas, I guess that part fell on deaf ears.

Globemaster2827

Personally... I'd factor in the UPS pension as $0 into my retirement planning. I'd rather not eat dog food if something went wrong. I can easily see the military retirement being means tested as we move to a more redistributive society despite the past.