This all boils down to your assumption; do you think we will have an A Plan in 5 years? 10 Years? 20 Years? If you plan on living another 20 years and the answer to any of those questions is no; I would think you would want the union to start adressing this sooner rather than later. Especially if you are retiring in the next 5 years, 10 years, 20 years.

 

LAG,
I don't think it's a matter of assuming who's correct in their assumptions about the future of the A-plan. The point I'm trying to make is there currently exists a huge future value for each individual in the A-plan. Specifically, the more junior you are, the easier it is to undervalue those future dollars. How do you recover that future value into today's dollars going into some sort of deferred compensation package? 7% B has a current limit of $13.5k. I just don't know of any vehicle which would allow us to defer those potential converted A dollars. To be sure, the company would low-ball us for some percentage on the dollar value.

 

I understand; JR guys are vulnerable if the A Fund is frozen and the Senior guys are vulnerable if the A fund flushes. If the A Fund survives till I die I win (my family may lose).

The question I have is can we work on a compromise. How about:

Next contract everyone will be given the option of having their A Fund percentage frozen (not high five) in exchange for a XX% B fund. When the B Fund contribution meets the IRS max the pilot will have an option of taking the excess as Christmas Bonus, Extra vacation, Makeup Sick, UPS stock options or FDA housing allowance.

Pilots will be given the option to change plans from date of implementation of current CBA until date of implementation of the next CBA.

Assuming the union gets the XX% B fund high enough I would take the option regardless of where I was in my career because now the money is part of my estate.

I know having two plans will cause us to hate each other and give the company a chance to play one group against the other (like under 53 vs over 53). But eventually one plan will "reign supreme" and adjustments can be made on the next contract.

Can we agree that some XX% B fund will make dumpng the A Plan worthwhile? Thus preserving it for the guys already depending on it. Can we talk about what XX% that would be. Do the R&I guys have the capability to compute that number?

 

Having two different plans would be a disaster waiting to happen in my opinion. (Meaning one group under a B plan only and another in an A plan or A/B plan mix) You already stated concens and reasons not to.

This is somehting the memebership will have to decide for themselves by a majority vote. I assume there will be a contract 2010 survey coming out in the year or 2.

Guys need to understand the pro's and cons of both A and B plans.

A plan
Pros: It is awesome if it is there when you retire, proven to pay more than a B plan.
Don't have to ugrade as soon as possible to max it out.
Professionally managed guaranteed rate of return whehter in an Bear or Bull market.
Cons: Uncertainty of future viability (no small matter)

B plan
Pros it is in you name and you control it.
Cons Low IRS CAPs 44k max/ year and capped at 230k so Capts can't max it out.
Must upgrade as soon as possible to maximize it.
Pilot controlled investment. Most of us are not Warren Buffet.
I would hate to be retireing in a Bear market under just my B plan 401k.


Transistioning from one to another is complex.
For a brand new Guy or a guy going out the door it is easy.
For everybody else it is vastly more complex.
If you make the assumption the company is going to buy out the A plan dollar for dollar I think you would be mistaken.

I think what the R & I guys are trying to do makes sense. Gradually rebalance every contract. Which is why the over 50 year olds each contract get the A small A plan bump.
A lumps sum option would be nice but I doubt we will ever see it.
There are other things that need to be done to portect the A plan.

The first was done by tieing our A plan in with FDX executives MGT. They terminate ours they must terminate theirs.

Second is we need to negotiate the company to Buy an Annuity for the guy walking out the door so he is protected.

Three (ALPA national with our urging) needs to lobby to increase B plan IRS caps, so a 10% B plan really is a 10% B plan.


Lastly the membership by majority has to decide the direction to go, but it must be an informed decision because each path has it's risks as well as +'s and -'s

 

deleted..........

 

You can say that again!

 

..............deleted

 

I was kidding!

 

Me too............the third one was a mistake

 

MD11Fr8Dog and Redeye,

Are you two competing to see who gets to 1900 posts first? Bwwaaahaaaahaaaa.

Ok, sorry for thread drift and back to whatever this thread was about. What is it about anyway?