Seat Lock?
11-28-2007 | 12:23 PM
#11
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From: Gear Monkey
This is the applicable part of the CBA
"Section 24 E. 1.
b. Down/Lateral Bid Restriction
Unless waived by the Vice President, Flight Operations, or his designee, a pilot may not receive a permanent vacancy award based on a down/lateral bid unless he has been in his current crew status for at least 18 months.
c. Down/Lateral Bid Freeze
A pilot who is activated in a crew status that requires ITU training based on a down/lateral bid shall be frozen in that crew status for 24 months, commencing on his actual activation date. A pilot is not eligible for a permanent crew position award requiring ITU training with a projected training date during that freeze period except under the following conditions:
i. the pilot was excessed or down/lateral bid to relieve an excess; or
ii. the pilot down bid because of legal restrictions."
So, as I read it, you must be on the 72 for 18 months before being awarded the same seat on the 75. However, if you were awarded the seat on the just completed posting, you either have the time, or it was waived by VP Flt Ops. Once activated, you will have a 24 month freeze if the assignment was a lateral or downbid, although being in an FDA and signing the Letter of Aggreement makes the freeze problematic, as you'll be there at least 24 months.
"Section 24 E. 1.
b. Down/Lateral Bid Restriction
Unless waived by the Vice President, Flight Operations, or his designee, a pilot may not receive a permanent vacancy award based on a down/lateral bid unless he has been in his current crew status for at least 18 months.
c. Down/Lateral Bid Freeze
A pilot who is activated in a crew status that requires ITU training based on a down/lateral bid shall be frozen in that crew status for 24 months, commencing on his actual activation date. A pilot is not eligible for a permanent crew position award requiring ITU training with a projected training date during that freeze period except under the following conditions:
i. the pilot was excessed or down/lateral bid to relieve an excess; or
ii. the pilot down bid because of legal restrictions."
So, as I read it, you must be on the 72 for 18 months before being awarded the same seat on the 75. However, if you were awarded the seat on the just completed posting, you either have the time, or it was waived by VP Flt Ops. Once activated, you will have a 24 month freeze if the assignment was a lateral or downbid, although being in an FDA and signing the Letter of Aggreement makes the freeze problematic, as you'll be there at least 24 months.
...given the CBA verbiage, I think your interpretation is spot on.
...and it is also the way the company applied the verbiage for 727 FOs who bid for 757 FO slots domestically (i.e. the 18 month lock was NOT waived)
...this is another important bidding dimension to fully understand for the next bid, especially as the rumors fly that there may be more than one 757 bid next year
...another early in the year in a second attempt to fill the FDAs before calling poolies, and one later for future domestic expansion (...all unsubstantiated rumors, of course!)
Thanks again for the specific CBA reference.
Last edited by DLax85; 11-28-2007 at 12:25 PM. Reason: clarity
11-28-2007 | 12:25 PM
#12
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From: MD-11 Captain
From a reliable anonymous source. 
Three terms:
Down/Lateral Bid: an award of a different crew status that is compensated at an hourly rate less than or equal to the hourly rate for the pilot’s current crew status. (CBA 24.E.1.a.)
Down/Lateral Bid RESTRICTION: (Unless waived blah blah blah ...) a pilot may not receive a permanent vacancy award based on a down/lateral bid unless he has been in his current crew status for at least 18 months. (CBA 24.E.1.b.)
Down/Lateral Bid FREEZE: A pilot who is activated ... based on a down/lateral bid shall be frozen in that crew status for 24 months, commencing on his actual activation
date. (CBA 24.E.1.c.)
One pertinent exception: A pilot subject to a down/lateral bid freeze or restriction is eligible for an award or assignment of his crew status at a new base. (CBA 24.E.1.d.i.) [Note it says "his crew status," not a new crew status. This would allow a 757 FO in Memphis to be awarded 757 FO CDG, but not 727 FO.]
The RESTRICTION applies before a pilot can down/lateral bid, the FREEZE occurs after the down/lateral bid, and they can both be waived for a new base (same crew status).
Three terms:
Down/Lateral Bid: an award of a different crew status that is compensated at an hourly rate less than or equal to the hourly rate for the pilot’s current crew status. (CBA 24.E.1.a.)
Down/Lateral Bid RESTRICTION: (Unless waived blah blah blah ...) a pilot may not receive a permanent vacancy award based on a down/lateral bid unless he has been in his current crew status for at least 18 months. (CBA 24.E.1.b.)
Down/Lateral Bid FREEZE: A pilot who is activated ... based on a down/lateral bid shall be frozen in that crew status for 24 months, commencing on his actual activation
date. (CBA 24.E.1.c.)
One pertinent exception: A pilot subject to a down/lateral bid freeze or restriction is eligible for an award or assignment of his crew status at a new base. (CBA 24.E.1.d.i.) [Note it says "his crew status," not a new crew status. This would allow a 757 FO in Memphis to be awarded 757 FO CDG, but not 727 FO.]
The RESTRICTION applies before a pilot can down/lateral bid, the FREEZE occurs after the down/lateral bid, and they can both be waived for a new base (same crew status).
11-28-2007 | 12:32 PM
#14
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From: Gear Monkey
I think the confusion arises from the average line pilot using the two terms interchangably.
Last edited by DLax85; 11-28-2007 at 12:33 PM. Reason: clarity
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